Hey everybody, let's run a country!

[Asherdan]

Y'know, I can get the point of what wombles is saying there since I've found my animal management style changing over the last several years as I get deeper into traditional 'stock'. There is a definite perspective difference.

ALSO: I went out on a 'fix a hoof' call and fixed up a new-to-me hoss. He had all kinds of well healed wire scars on his chest and front end legs, when I asked if he'd tried to run over a fence the guy told me "yeah, ever since we've been calling him Dr. hossnstein."

Dude, I thought that was some funny.

[arkabee]

if someone wants to raise dogs like livestock, hey, that's great.
just don't sell them as pets,
sell them as live stock.

because noone wants to buy a near feral, inbred, chronic fucked up dog at a pot (edit- hahah, pot store? ok, maybe they would... how about a pet store though)  store for 500 dollars.

maybe some people wouldn't mind eatin' them, though, but not for that markup.

i love hearing the 'breeders' whine (like the dogs they are 'breeding') about how the government is trying to interfere with their business practice. none of them give a shit that the government precludes me from making a profit running them down for cash.

the missouri thing is bullshit politics, all the way around.  i was listening to the ads for the vote all "season" coming out of the bootheel. 

it's not a rural/city issue.  i think it's a "these 'breeders' are giving me a shit load of money so i'm going to kiss their ass" thing or a "i'm going to make it seem to be a rural/city issue so i can make myself seem edgy and important and more 'conservative' and 'homey'" thing.

seriously, missouri, i was born in you.  do you want to be a state where 'people' 'breed' dogs like slaughter pigs to sell them to your kids for christmas, or do you want to be a state where people breed dogs?

i expect better of you, show me state.  i know you have to deal with Haiti Heights, but you don't have to deal with this bullshit too.

[JorgeFabregas]

The agriculture argument comes in mainly because opponents of the prop said it was a slippery slope that would inevitably lead to heavy regulation of enclosed hog farms. Of course there's no ambiguity in the prop about the animal in question. So the idea is that now that Missouri voters have shown that they are open to regulation regarding some animals, outside animal activists will swoop in and force them to change their laws regarding all other animals (not that I would be opposed to this, but I know the treatment of dogs and the treatment of livestock has no connection in most people's minds).

Apparently they made the same argument against the banning of cockfights in the nineties.

[wombat]

if someone wants to raise dogs like livestock, hey, that's great.
just don't sell them as pets,
sell them as live stock.

because noone wants to buy a near feral, inbred, chronic fucked up dog at a pot (edit- hahah, pot store? ok, maybe they would... how about a pet store though)  store for 500 dollars.

That is a really good way to frame the issue.

I totally sympathize with people who are afraid of extremist animal activists. For some of those people, their dream world is one where no one owns a pet or has any contact or relationship with any animal at all. Those people are totally my enemy. I can hardly see how that's a reason to allow people to breed dogs in any fucked up way they want, however.

[Asherdan]

This kind of stuff is a major "you do lose" thing because when you're arguing to not do what is right (regulate puppy mill operations above the level of a Lovecraftian horror) because of other bad things that may happen then, indeed, you do lose.

After work today I'm going to drop by and clean out a hoof wall abscess that is crippling up this real beauty of a quarterhoss stallion before the damage leaves him permanent lame. He's being neglected by an absentee owner. I'm going to submit a nice official invoice for services rendered and consider, when lack of payment happens, going in with the property owner who has keeping bills accruing on either forcing sale of the hoss for payment or transfer of ownership to one of us in lieu of payment.

It'll be a PITA but I'm fooking tired of watching this hoss swolter. It's a better option that tying him to the fence out front and giving the dummy a phone call saying "get your hoss before animal control does."

[Asherdan]

Oh, and I'm going to not have much for dinner tonight because what I'm going to clean out of that hoof is going to be nasty.

[Choop]

don't get kicked

[arkabee]

That is a really good way to frame the issue.

another great way to frame it would have been for those in favor of the legislation to have met with, visited, and discussed the issue with the puppy factory owners and operators.

and filmed it.

and then shown the film.

i'm not talking about the puppies, or where they live.

and i'm not talking about editing it to make the people look bad.

no, i mean the voters should really get to know the real 'people' who would be economically impacted by the legislation.

but then i think it's lazy to hate a nameless, faceless group of people and just know them by some simple and fallible label.  the correct way to hate a man is to know his name and how he smells and how he spits chaw in the parking space so when you get out of the car you step in it as you go and put his motherfuck*ng cart into the cart return.

dammit i am worked up, wtf was i thinking being in this thread?
you know when i joined touamb? around the 04 election.  i think we can guess why i joined touamb rather than, say, fascistsdressedasbunnies.org or freethinkerswhoreallyjustdontwanttopayt axes.org instead.  it's because i hate mycardiologist and want his new pool to never be payed for by my forthcoming massive stroke.


also, and more importantly:

asherdan is rad.

[miles]

This thread isn't technically dead, is it? Didn't know where else to post this.

Each political party has found it easy to turn on a dime from decrying to defending the blocking of judicial nominations, depending on their changing political fortunes.

Ohhhhh shiiiiiiit!

[jaydub]

I didn't know Captain Obvious wore black robes.

[lprkn]

Justice Obvious to you, mister.

[Choop]

Breaking News Alert
The New York Times
Wed, January 19, 2011 -- 6:09 PM ET
-----

House Votes to Repeal Health Care Law

The House on Wednesday voted to repeal the Democrats'
landmark health care overhaul, in a largely symbolic step
that the new Republican majority said marked the beginning of
an all-out effort to dismantle President Obama's signature
domestic policy achievement.

Leaders of the Democratic-controlled Senate have said that
they will not act on the repeal measure, effectively
scuttling it.

A House majority voted 245 to 189 to repeal the measure.

ugh. at least the senate seems a little saner here.

[Nabubrush]

I had read that was coming a little while ago. Fuck those guys.

[Doc]

Seriously, you're paying these dudes to make 'largely symbolic gestures'?

[pmcd9]

Seriously, you're paying these dudes to make 'largely symbolic gestures'?

Well yeah, that and obstruct any real progress.