The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Trivial Pursuits => People & Places => Topic started by: AlohaDawg on March 10, 2005, 07:51:39 am
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Trouble!
The political environment of my current position has resulted in my HQ deciding to redeploy me to Los Angeles. As of this morning (I'm hoping something changes tomorrow) my only option is Los Angeles.
My wife is not about to move to Los Angeles, and after some fairly intense soul searching and prayerful meditation, I am starting to believe that I need to stay here in Hawaii with my family.
Here is the problem: If I stay, I lose my Federal job, there is no hope of paid relocation to the mainland, and I'm guaranteed a pay cut of at least 25%.
There is a small chance that a relocation to Miami or Chicago could happen, either of which I think I would do.
I need some help with this LA thing, though. I need the few of you who live out there to sell me the LA experience - why do I want to move there? Schools? Neighborhoods? Cost of Living? How about kids? The office would be on Grand Ave not far from the Staples Center. I need to know where I can live/ what I can get for like 65K -68K a year.
Help a brother out here, I am really not wanting to go there but I am also really not wanting to give up 14 years with this organization.
Also, does anyone out there work for a large health insurance provider? I found some jobs here that look interesting but I need a little help with interpreting the duties. Pay starts at half what I'm getting now and up to 87% or so.
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Oh wow.
Well, I have never lived in LA, but I have visited a lot, and it is my greatest fantasy to live there, so I can be encouraging, and you can take it with as big a grain of salt as you like.
LA is totally beautiful and totally cool. It has everything you want in a city (OK, except decent public transit), but it has the beautiful ocean and mountains and perfect weather. It has all the cultural attractions of a city, and also what surprised me is that it's really a pretty old place, so it has all the pleasures of urban decay that I didn't expect to find in California. There is interesting history and charming neighborhoods, and, I know no one else cares, all the Japanese food and shopping you could ever want without moving to Japan.
As a New Yorker I can't believe I am saying this, but another cool thing about LA is that is kind of like New York in that it's one of those places that's really central to our culture (even if you feel like you have to put 'culture' in quotes.) You feel like you are at the center of something and not out in the sticks.
Oranges grow on trees there, and avocados. Flowers bloom in the middle of winter. Everyone is happy there, even the people who work in, like, coffee bars, because they live in LA and they never have to worry about it snowing on them. And they can go just a little way and look at the ocean and it makes them calm and happy.
Yeah, OK, this is an East Coaster talking... you already have a lot of this in Hawaii, but, if you don't have a job in Hawaii, that's not relevant, right?
I know none of this answers your practical questions. Just a little waxing rhapsodic about the possibility. It sounds like maybe youall could use a slightly unrealistic glow of positive feelings about the place...
I am so jealous that you have this opportunity that to you seems like a terrible exile... isn't life crazy unfair?
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Wombat wears rose colored glasses.
~Paul
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Wombat wears rose colored glasses.
~Paul
Shhhh!
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I'm on my way out the door, but for now I will say that obviously you and I both know that you have to put your family first. It's just hard to know what "putting your family first" means in this situation. Is it better to be with them in a city where they're unhappy (assuming they'd be unhappy in LA - I know if I lived in Hawaii as a kid and had to move to LA I'd think I was being *punished*) or to stay where you are and make less money with which to provide for them?
If you have to choose, though, between your familial happiness and 87% of your current income, that ain't no decision at all, Dawg.
TAKE THE MONEY AND RUN. YOU CAN BUY A NEW FAMILY LATER.
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All I can tell you is that both my SO and I grew up in low income families (where the type of salary you are talking about would have been equivilent to wining the lottery) but that it was our family environment that determined that his childhood was extremely happy and mine, not so much so.
A mentor of mine always told me "Money really doesn't buy happiness, but it does by options." I always keep this in mind when I'm making financial decisions. It sounds like, from your post, that your heart is really in the home you've made for yourself where you are now. And lots of your previous posts seem to link a part of your identity to the Alhoa state - which is not to say you can't plant roots elsewhere, but are you and LA guy or is your home really your family, wherever they may be?
I don't have any of the facts you seek, just encouragement - you're passionate about being a good partner and father, we've all seen that in your posts. Keep your family first, as you always have, and keep us posted!
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Have to say, if it's possible for you to make enough to live where you are, I'd do that. I despise money, and am with Smells on this one... Better to be happy, as long as you get by, than to be raking it in. I too grew up in relative poverty, (comfortable enough but everyone around me had more and flaunted it) and I wouldn't trade that childhood in for one in a richer family.
Plus, well, I'm now pretty much of the mind that I want to avoid the US, and LA is one of the last parts of the US I'd be willing to go to, let alone to live in.
Even so, and I've said this before, 8.something% tax? That's nothing!
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Even so, and I've said this before, 8.something% tax? That's nothing!
Shit, I was pissed when we went up to 5%. At least my state isn't trying to tax hybrid cars for not using enough gas.
As for the actual problem, this is way beyond my maturity level, plus I've never been to LA. The DC metro area is nice. And we have federal jobs oozing out of our various major orifices.
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More of my two cents:
I think LA would be a totally cool place for a kid to grow up. (Someone else can worry about schools. I am in charge of the poetry of the situation, here.) Also, I remembered that that thing I said about Japanese shopping, etc., isn't irrelevant after all - didn't you once say that your daughter tried to take her shoes off before going in the house in a raging snowstorm?
On the other hand... Although I am the Move To LA Cheerleader, I have to admit that I know a lot of people who seem miserable but say they can't make any changes because of what they'd lose by giving up their Federal job. It can be really awful to let yourself be trapped by those considerations.
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Even so, and I've said this before, 8.something% tax? That's nothing!
Shit, I was pissed when we went up to 5%.
Here in Manitoba: Government Sales Tax 7% and Provencial Sales Tax 7%! That's right folks, a total of 14% tax on all purchases! But hey, I don't ever have to pay to see a doctor, and with the amount of medical stuff I've been through, the government is practically paying me.
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this (http://www.rossiusa.com/products/product-details.cfm?model=R35102&category=revolver)
do, Do, DOoo!
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Oh! How could I forget! Idyllic photographs of my little stuffed Japanese friend visiting California:
http://www.rebsig.com/kogepan/index.html
How could you not want to go? Right now!
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Holy fuck*ng shit.
Alright, I need a moment to get my response together. And I may just send it straight to Jason rather than posting it here.
Wombat: when were you in Venice? Or is this one of those traveling-garden-gnome type of dealies?
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Isn't the cost of living in Hawaii just insane?
I mean, I know it's expensive to live in or around LA too, but isn't LA cheaper than Hawaii?
And think of what you'll save on the price of goods and services that do not need to be imported.
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Trouble!
I'm sorry about your trouble. I pray your family gets through it well and comes out stronger at the other end. I'm sorry I don't have any helpful information for you. I'm even sorrier that I'm going to provide uninformed and unasked-for opinions about the place.
WARNING: What follows are the impressions of a East Coaster / Southerner who never left the town he grew up in. This guy hasn't even met that many people from California. The following paragraph probably won't be helpful to anyone. You sound like you really don't want to move there anyway. I recommend you skip over the rest of this post.
Dude, Los Angeles is a hole. Don't freaking move there. The people are fake. The traffic is ungodly. The cost of living rivals that of living in space. People say, "Oh but the weather's nice." It's not nice. It's the desert. If you stopped pumping water in from and thus destroying neighboring communities, LA would dry up like vacuum sealed prune ashes. It's unnatural. All living with people who think they're going to be great actors and people who think they're already great because they know computers. Terrible place. Really. And two more words for you: race, riots. Who needs that action? Not this guy. No sir. And sure that doesn't happen often, but you know what does happen often? Earthquakes. LA: an expensive pain-in-the-ass place full of fake-ass people and earthquakes. The city is such a pain, people can't even take the time to say its full name. The best part of LA is the shoe company LA Gear, and that's pretty low. So really, take the pay cut. I'm not sure how expensive Hawaii is, but moving from most parts of the world to Los Angeles is pretty much like taking a pay cut anyway. LA == a hole worse than Courney Love's band. When friends of mine say they want to move to LA, I ask them if they've considered less expensive ways of ruining their lives. Like cocaine addictions. Man. I hate that place. I don't even know where all this anger comes from.
This has been a self-serving announcement from a guy who probably doesn't know what he's talking about.
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No, no, no!
Pedro is adorable and sexy and brilliant and charming but he is WRONG.
And yeah, I had the same thought as Jough - isn't it really expensive to live in Hawaii too?
Limmo, I want to read your answer too... I was in Venice with Kogepan, I would not let him go by himself like the garden gnome. I have been there for a couple of weeks a couple of times, a couple of years ago. My friend in Orange County - the one I visited the time we didn't have the West Coast Ache-con - used to live there when she was in law school. The picture of Kogepan eating a taco on the Venice boardwalk is central to my fantasy, it's in front of a little half-empty office complex that faces the ocean. I dream of having a little office there where I sit and write my third series of murder mysteries, which would be set in Venice, of course, and eating wonderful green chile tacos for lunch - wonderful tacos, AD, it's a culinary paradise - and getting a foot massage once in a while from the strange Chinese massage place on the first floor. With the windows wide open to the sea breeze and the pugs asleep at my feet. And watching the sun set and then walking home to my odd little house on the Venice walk streets.
This doesn't help AD though... unless it helps to make him believe what a wonderful fantasyland LA is.
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That's right folks, a total of 14% tax on all purchases!
17.5.
On anything not bought in this fuck*ng country now too.
So basically, at least LA is cheap to live in.
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Slink? Shut the fuck up. Pedro? Double shut the fuck up.
Wombat? I understand your fantasy regarding Venice Beach. It is a neato place full of great restaurants and artists. It also has plenty of bullet-spraying gang activity. So it’s kind of a trade-off.
Aloha? First of all, according to salary.com, the cost of living in L.A. would be 4.6% lower than living and working in Honolulu. Which would give you an extra $2500 in income per year. Yippee.
Alright, you’re going to be working in downtown Los Angeles. You will not be living there, because the only people who live downtown are artists and other avant single people.
You have kids. You will need to put them in school. As someone in a post above said, the L.A Unified School District is hit-or miss at best. The quality of schools is much better here in the South Bay – El Segundo and the beach communities ( Redondo, Manhattan, Hermosa, Seal…Torrance is good too ). But if you move down here…
Your home and job will be nowhere near each other, so you will have to get a car you really like. Because your ass will be sitting in it for at least an hour every weekday.
I don’t know if you own your home or you rent. The housing market here in Los Angeles is ABSOLUTELY fuck*ng ABSURD. You’re looking at $400,000 for a house here, bare minimum. Renting is less steep, but still not cheap.
Asherdan’s points are right on the money. On the other hand, Wombat’s fantasy vision of L.A. is not as rose-tinted as other posters here seem to think it is. The only place in America that Southern California suffers in comparison to is, well, Hawaii. And there’s a hell of a lot more going on here than there. L.A. is great, especially in comparison to, I dunno, Houston or Scotland or ( rolling eyes ) North Carolina.
However, all this is fairly moot, owing to the third paragraph of your post. Your wife, you say, is not about to move to Los Angeles. If that’s really the case, then guess what? You’re staying in Hawaii.
A blog about life here (http://www.postcardsfromla.com/blog/).
A very helpful page for finding decent schools out here. (http://store.schoolwisepress.com/index.html)
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Limmo is Mean.
~Paul
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Limmo is Mean.
~Paul
Only to people who talk shit about where I live. Especially people who have never been here. I would have been nicer, but Pedro's boilerplate bullshit about how horrible everything/everyone is out here kinda got me cranky a bit.
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Well, as someone who was just offered a job in Baltimore, I say, doesn't anyplace worth going have a little bullet-spraying gang activity?
It's true about the cost of houses. My friend's little two-bedroom house in Orange County was about 500,000. But even though it's small, it's wonderful. And your house doesn't need to be as big when you can spend time outside in the yard twelve months of the year.
And as for the commute - I seem to recall, AD, that you've sometimes talked about getting a job in DC someday? Most people's commutes here are just as long, and sometimes they have to make them in the SNOW.
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Judging by the other responses in this thread, it really sounds like LA is livable but not a huge step up from your lifestyle now. This means that the real question is what your family has to say about it. When you say that your wife is "not about to move to Los Angeles" -- how firm in that is she? (In other words, how many problems will it cause if you decide to move?) And what's the root of her objections? The kids are also a factor -- the baby, maybe not so much, but your other daughter is certainly old enough to have a voice (not a deciding vote, but a voice).
Honestly, the best advice I can give is to make sure your family can get entirely behind whatever decision you end up making. Moving a fairly long distance is hard enough even with the full support of a family, but if your loved ones are going to be miserable in LA, there really isn't enough money in the world to make that a good decision.
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'dawg- that is the suck. sorry to hear it.
why has noone talked about smog? isn't smog the fundemental backbone of L.A.?
in a weird sort of synchronicity, i read this today:
http://ezraklein.typepad.com/blog/2005/03/election_day.html
which is about the current L.A. mayoral elections etc. i thought it was interesting.
i was not aware the housing market in the L.A. area was so bad, i thought that was localized to the Bay Area. it saddens me. Be Very Afraid of the Housing Bubble. I would not want to be moving to Cali at this point in time. Maybe in 5 years you could pick up some cheap foreclosed properties, but right now it's frightening.
Isn't L.A. the simplest example to show what "Sprawl" is? I'd assume that would be the single greatest difference between Hawaii and it.
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So I'll throw a tie-breaker at you: If you come out the first round of barbeque is at my humble abode. I'll even clean the hot tub for you.
And if you're coming here to check the place out, I volunteer to act as your tour guide / Cub Scout Leader.
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They say the fuckin' smog is the fuckin' reason you have such beautiful fuckin' sunsets.
I don't know squat about LA but if it would hurt your family to move there (or worse, separate you from your family for an extended period) than even if they pay you double it ain't worth it, Dawg.
Unless you *want* to get away from your family, in which case go for it.
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Some of my most memorable vacations are in Southern California, the best being a small trip last year when I attended the Coachella festival. Afterwards, I stayed in the Hilton on Sunset, where I got LAID. It was kickass. It's a beautiful place to visit. I love walking around Sunset, hanging out on the beach, Disneyland, all that shit, but I don't know if I would ever live there. The goal is to have enough money to visit there often, and live somewhere more laid back (probably somewhere else in the Southwest, or possibly back up to the Pacific Northwest). The traffic is way too much, and earthquakes freak me out (growing up in Seattle, I guess you get that way, because they big one's always coming). Although, Venice is one of the most charming places in the US, and one day, it may be worth it.
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I stayed in the Hilton on Sunset, where I got LAID.
I heard there were lots of hookers down on Sunset. Is that still true miles?.
~Paul
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And as for the commute - I seem to recall, AD, that you've sometimes talked about getting a job in DC someday? Most people's commutes here are just as long, and sometimes they have to make them in the SNOW.
Only if you're silly enough to drive all the way into DC from say, Ashburn. Or like my coworker who goes Bethesda->Reston.
Also, when you say $400K for a house, I can only assume that you meant to type townhouse because otherwise that's sounding pretty cheap.
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I really appreciate several of these posts and I'm totally entertained by all of them.
Median housing cost on Oahu is $505,000 as of this year. So in the greater LA area I can do OK I'm sure in comparison to here, that's one consideration. Spending 2 hours in the car on average every workday is pretty much a dealbreaker for me. That is definitely a major quality of life issue for me. Also, we have a general excise tax that is at 4.166% which is reiterated throughout the manufacturing and distribution process so that when you buy something the price is inflated by that tax being assessed 2-3 times prior to purchase.
I applied for several jobs with HMSA here in Hawaii that sound intriguing but of course would be pay cuts. Cost of paradise and all that. I know that SoCal can be beautiful and until the report date is come and gone I can't say whether we are going to be there or not (it will be a tough sell for the woman in my life) but I do appreciate your input, especially those of you who live there.
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Ok and just for more background:
On Monday they called and said I had to move and that there were several options including Miami and North Carolina. They mentioned LA and and I mentioned that would be pretty low on my list of places to go.
On Wednesday I called them back to tell them that we discussed it and we would like to go to Miami and specifically, that I didn't want to go to LA.
Before I could even get to my request for Miami, they flat out told me that they had met and decided to relocate me to LA. No option. No input. No choices. Short time-frame.
They were nice enough to also mention that they expected me to spend about two years in LA and then move again.
Given this information, do you think I should even entertain remaining in the employ of this agency let alone move at their whim?
I'm inclined to seek my fortune away from the public teat on which I have nursed for so long but only time will tell on this one. LA people, keep sounding off, your input is totally appreciated.
(http://fourcatsinabag.blogspot.com/images.jpg)
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Well, that sure sounds like a Take This Job and Shove It moment.
But then you wouldn't get to live in LA!!!!
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Man, I'm sorry, taking the job (in both hands if necessary) and shoving seems indicated. Best to see how things work out with new prospects in Hawaii, though. That said.. wow. Wow wow wow.
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Been away from the computer all day today (14 hour workdays suck) which is why it's taken me this long to say, "Dude, that sucks!" Dawg, I'm sorry you're going through this. This too shall pass and all that.
Some random thoughts:
If Mama ain't happy, ain't NOBODY happy.
I've been to LA twice now and liked it both times. I get the feeling that I shouldn't and that I should like NoCal better (not that I've been there), but I like LA anyway. This boy from the green rollin' hills of old Kentucky likes the desert.
RE: the Government teat thing. This is a tough analysis. How many years do you have in already? In my case this would make a huge difference. Currently I have 17 years until I can retire. I can buy 5, which cuts it to 12. Each year brings me closer to the point where I can tough out almost anything for a little while to get that substantial financial benefit. Also, I like working for the government. It's nice to wear the white hat.
What about job satisfaction? Do you like what you do? Insurance companies kind of really suck (Before my current job I regulated insurers for 6 years, so I know something of where I speak.) What's your dream job? Would you be moving closer to or farther from it?
And of course as a Dad, family considerations are huge. Even if the job, the location and the money are all great it's worthless if your family is going to be miserable.
Tax: Ky has 6% sales tax. However we also have property taxes, federal income tax, state income tax, FICA, Insurance premium taxes, Fuel excise tax etc, etc, etc. I don't want to get into a huge examination of who has the higher total tax burden -- it's probably Slink. But just looking at sales tax or VAT is only a tiny fraction of the whole picture, innit?
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I would have been nicer, but Pedro's boilerplate bullshit about how horrible everything/everyone is out here kinda got me cranky a bit.
You may be pleased to know that Pedro has been reprimanded by his wife for spouting off about things of which he knows very little. Given that most of what we know about LA comes from Steve Martin movies, I think he was probably out of line.
FWIW, I'd like to take this opportunity to tell A.D. that if the North Carolina option comes up again, he should throw himself at it as hard as possible, as long as the office is in an actual city. (We only have two -- Raleigh and Charlotte. Durham thinks it's a city, but it's not.) North Carolina is a fantastic place for families, and it's still relatively cheap to live here because -- well, for Pete's sake, it's the South. Southern folk don't abide by high taxes.
North Carolina: You Can't Buy Booze on Sunday, But You Can Get a Gun at Wal-Mart.
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North Carolina: You Can't Buy Booze on Sunday, But You Can Get a Gun at Wal-Mart.
1. HI JL!!!!
2. That goes for Ky too. I think you could probably buy a gun at Kroger on a Sunday, but not a six pack. (despite the fact that our biggest industries are tobacco, whiskey, racehosss and marijuana. Kentucky! We'll sell it to you, just take it elsewhere!)
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I stayed in the Hilton on Sunset, where I got LAID.
I heard there were lots of hookers down on Sunset. Is that still true miles?.
Oh yeah.
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Point of order:
Disneyland is in Anaheim, which is in Orange County, which is NOT part of LA regardless of what that lackluster bastard of a baseball team owner would have the rest of the world think.
Oh I know, but it's close enough to LA to be another good reason for visiting LA. Southern California, all the way down to San Diego, is just a place I like. I spent a lot of time there growing up, until most of my family moved away.
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I think you could probably buy a gun at Kroger on a Sunday, but not a six pack.
Back home, I can buy a gun at the local mall, in a sporting-goods store. And not just animal hunting guns, people hunting guns too. They actually had the huge-ass 50 Magnums, last time I was there, and little Saturday Night Specials for about $60. It was chilling when a friend and I were home for winter break, walked into the store and realized we could actually purchase a handgun, and then walk directly into the mall proper.
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Disneyland is in Anaheim, which is in Orange County, which is NOT part of LA regardless of what that lackluster bastard of a baseball team owner would have the rest of the world think.
You mean The The Angels Angels of Anaheim?
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people hunting guns too.
Aaieeee....
As a native New Yorker who finds anything south of DC rather frightening, I actually would second jl's point about North Carolina. It's quite surprisingly (to me) civilized in the cities there (even Durham). There are lots of worse choices.
That's only if I haven't convinced you to live in LA though. Do you have any idea how humid it is in NC? In LA they don't even know what humidity is.
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Of course there are hookers on Sunset. That's how you tell when the seasons have changed: when they start wearing jackets, it's autumn.
Aloha: when I said an hour in the car, that was including both legs of your trip. If you can afford a $500K house, you don't need to move to the sticks. You would still have a commute to downtown, but it wouldn't be so completely horrible.
From my completely ill-informed vantage point, I'd say move to L.A. ( free relocation to the mainland ), either buy or rent a place, and then start actively seeking a non-government job once you're here. Hell, you could get a nice townhouse in Santa Monica, where the schools are good ( not part of LAUSD ) and figure out what the next move is.
More input later.
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No job, not even one you really, really love, should ever become your life! Aloha, your employers are saying "we're going to fuck you, and you're going to like it" Pardon the french, but that is what it is that they are saying to you. Having felt the horrible barbed-c*ck sting of my employers doing suck nastiness to me in the past has convinced me that I will never let them tear my proverbial prom dress again. If they're saying they're going to move you again in another two years, and who knows how many more times after that, the impact on your family is going to be huge! Have some dignity.
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From my completely ill-informed vantage point, I'd say move to L.A. ( free relocation to the mainland ), either buy or rent a place, and then start actively seeking a non-government job once you're here.
I like this. Screw them by taking your relocation expenses and then tell them to shove the job. It's perfect.
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From my completely ill-informed vantage point, I'd say move to L.A. ( free relocation to the mainland ), either buy or rent a place, and then start actively seeking a non-government job once you're here.
I like this. Screw them by taking your relocation expenses and then tell them to shove the job. It's perfect.
I'd think there'd be a clause for this. Like if you quite in <6 months you have to pay them back for the move or something. Unless the gov't is even dumber than I thought.
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I'd think there'd be a clause for this. Like if you quite in <6 months you have to pay them back for the move or something. Unless the gov't is even dumber than I thought.
Oh, I'm not proposing that he just show up here and quit. Totally changing your life around in a new city would take more than six months.
No one ever went broke underestimating the dumbness of the government. Especially defense contractors.
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Okay, I'm getting sort of confused. I was under the impression that just about the only reason that AD was thinking about taking the LA job was because of the job itself -- that is, if he wasn't going to be keeping the job anyway, it would be best just to stay in Hawaii, since it sounds like his family doesn't want to relocate. Why the "move to LA and then quit" stuff? Just for the paid relocation to the mainland?
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AD, you are not their bitch. I know you have to think about the security of your family and such, and that they think they have you over a barrel or something, but godDAMN people would be tasting my Fists of FURY ™ if they tried to force me into a quick move to another city and expected me to just play ball.
Don't be a pussy - kick them in the nuts and take as many of those motherFUCKERS down as you head on your way out.
I'm talkin' shotgun notice, beeeeeeeeeyotchhhhhhhhhhh.
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Okay, I'm getting sort of confused. I was under the impression that just about the only reason that AD was thinking about taking the LA job was because of the job itself -- that is, if he wasn't going to be keeping the job anyway, it would be best just to stay in Hawaii, since it sounds like his family doesn't want to relocate. Why the "move to LA and then quit" stuff? Just for the paid relocation to the mainland?
AD seemed to indicate that a paid relocation is important. I don't know how expensive it is to schlep all your physical possessions halfway across the Pacific, but I can't imagine it would be cheap. It also sounds like AD is over a barrel - his employers are giving him a short time window, so it's either move or lose a job he's had for a long time and be unemployed in Hawaii while finding a new job. Either choice presents a lot of uncertainty. We're just trying to throw in our two cents.
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RE: the Government teat thing. This is a tough analysis. How many years do you have in already? In my case this would make a huge difference. Currently I have 17 years until I can retire. I can buy 5, which cuts it to 12. Each year brings me closer to the point where I can tough out almost anything for a little while to get that substantial financial benefit. Also, I like working for the government. It's nice to wear the white hat.
I have 14 years in and I'm 37 this year. So it's kind of between where you would absolutely just throw it away and be chained to it permanently.
Since we just had Sarah and I have a bunch of sick time banked, I may take at least 10 weeks of Family Medical Leave. If I quit I can sell back all my leave time (I carried over 240 hours in January) and also cash in the FERS which is a pretty small amount since I've been doing the TSP.
That would be like being employed for 6 months or so without having to work. That should give me time to figure out what I want to be when I grow up.
Because Asherdan put it best. There is no longer a compact between myself and the headquarters of my job and there is probably no chance that I'm going to develop a level of trust that goes with my level of belief in the mission. And I can always tie myself to the mission of another organization, and if they treat me better that's just a nice bonus.
Yeah, we would have a hell of a relocation if I quit and eventually we want go back to the mainland. I am looking at a job in the immunization program in Atlanta, though - I could live with that and keep my time, I guess but it keeps me with the organization...did you ever meet someone in a terrible marriage who stays in it for the kids or because being out there alone is scarier than being in a situation that is no good, either hurtful or just lacking in personal growth? That's how I feel sometimes. Although my occupational and intellectual needs have been fairly well served, there is so much more that isn't and although those other things are my responsibility for the most part, I think that getting out of this particular job situation will better make building my spiritual, social, physical, and emotional/mental wellness and that of my family.
Time will tell , I guess. I definitely can't commit publicly to a course of action but we might go and we might stay. I do appreciate all of your input and discussion.
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Vaya con dios, man. With the amount of concern you obviously have for your family, I'm sure you'll figure something out.
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Well, if you think L.A. is the way, PM me when you're coming out for a scouting mission and I'll do what I can to help you.
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The fuck. It has been double-shut.
I meant to post this much sooner, but work and the Pearce have been quite hectic. I'd like to apologize to Limmo and the residents of Los Angeles. It's not every day I get to insult three million people at once, and perhaps I should not have taken that opportunity. I tried to disclaim it before writing it, but as Sun Tzu said, "Apologizing in advance doesn't keep you from being an asshole, it just makes you a certain kind of asshole."
I think my dislike of Los Angeles stems mainly from the fact that the stereotypical things that people complain about it are exactly the things I dislike. Also, as a high school and college actor, I was surrounded by people who couldn't wait to get out of this shitty town and move there, as if just being there would make them rich and happy beyond their abilities to comprehend.
I like where I live. I'm surrounded -- for the most part -- by kind, well-educated, honest people. Of course, I grew up in a suburb that went from 7,000 to 100,000 people in the last thirty years. Effectively, the little town I grew up in doesn't exist, thirty miles in any direction is the sticks, and I have no culture to call my own. Still I love Raleigh, and even Cary. They're home.
New York I've been to. Many of the folks that are now my neighbors are from there. It's huge and busy, but it's also kind of comforting. I feel like I can understand it. New York is a place people come from.
Los Angeles is a place people go to. And I never hear from them again. Maybe there's a reason. I know they can't all get rich. You see all the thousands of actors and screenwriters going out there to get rich, and it makes you weep. Like 49'ers. And JL's right. My opinions are far too informed by Steve Martin.
So let's have a breakdown. Los Angeles and Raleigh. What exactly do I hate.
Los Angeles has smog. The Triangle area (Raleigh, Durham, Cary, and Chapel Hill) have one third of the number of people as LA, and our air quality is still third worst in the nation.
Sprawl. Los Angeles has ten times as many people as Raleigh in only four times the space. Who's sprawling now?
Crime. There's a lot of unsavory places in Los Angeles, but Durham has Crips and Bloods now too. The big difference is that our gangs aren't really fighting over much money or turf. They're kind of pathetic. They still shoot up little kids, but for less reason.
Earthquakes. Los Angeles trembles every so often. We have floods, tornadoes, ice storms (some that produce 1 inch of snow and paralyze the city for ten hours), and oh by the way hurricanes.
Traffic. We have four cities all trying to pile commuters into the same set of business campuses day in and day out. And our officials all complain that a public train system is too liberal for this area.
Unnatural Water Pumping. In areas of my state not too far from my town, farmers grow hogs shoulder to shoulder and stacked four high (exaggeration). There are more pigs in this state than people (not an exaggeration). When the lagoons of shit get too deep, the 'farmers' spray the hog shit over fields until the runoff causes massive giraffe kills. One opened up right down the road from my grandparents house. They moved. So as for being unnatural. Los Angeles gets a dirty look. North Carolina gets the lethal injection.
Race Riots: Raleigh had hangings. We've still got KKK. Not many, but we can't get rid of them, like they're white-hooded cochroaches.
Weather: People say, "Oh but the weather's nice." Okay. It's nice out there. I prefer it here. We get a little bit of snow, some rain, and a lot of sun. I like the variation. But I'm sure I wouldn't complain if it was just nice all the damn time.
Prices: Los Angeles is expensive, but they pay well. Things might not be terribly expensive out here, but if you leave Wake County, you're going to hit a poverty rate like you would believe.
LA Gear: Represents all that is wrong with this world in general and Los Angeles in particular. That one you don't get forgiven for. The band Hole either. Are they from around there? Probably Seattle. Anyway, they suck.
I would like to reiterate that I love Raleigh. I like the direction we're going. We're getting bigger, but we're trying to do so in a way that's sustainable and not sprawling. We don't always succeed, but how can you overlook that determination.
Los Angeles, I'd love to see sometime. Again, it's just that the bad things generally attributed to the city and its inhabitants in comedic monologues are things that I loathe. Also, I just don't like that everybody abbreviates it. It always sounds so over-hip. I'm sorry I'd been holding onto my childish belief that it was all that is wrong with this country and indeed this plane of existence. I'm more sorry, I decided to spout it off unasked for.
I'm also sorry for this post the size of Moby Dick. Geez Louise! I should be working. Please excuse me.
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That was a nice apology Pedro. Limmo, now that Pedro has appologized for dissing LA, are you gonna appologize for dissing large chunks of the rest of the country [And Scotland too]?
I don't know if this is of any use to you Dawg, but the theme of This American Life this week was entitled Should I Stay or Should I Go (http://www.thislife.org/). It's all about people forced to make decisions not entirely unlike what you are faced with. You can hear the show at that link, it's the second story down the page.
~Paul
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Hey, guess what? I've been out of the loop for awhile, but I'm going to go ahead and not read this post at fuck*ng all. It's too goddamn long, and I've been drinking all morning. Fuck LA. You said Chicago was available. Chicago fuck*ng rules, bitch. Also, fuck it, come to Portland! Seriously, though - just do what is best for your family. As I think Wombat said, it would be kind of cool to live in a place that is so integral to the cultural development of America as LA, but are you going to have any meaningful interactions?
We had Eliot Smith (but he's dead). But I know someone who knew him!
I told you fuckers about the drinking! I'm going to go rock in the garden. Rock On!!!
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Also, fuck the slamming of other parts of the country. Pedro, I love you, but no. Just no. Everbody loves something or other, but we're talking about someone who is undergoing a drastic life-change. LA is kind of suck in some ways, but speaking as someone who has just finished his state taxes ($4500 simoleons) - you pay for this but they give you that.
If LA is what it takes, just do as Young MC suggests and bust a move. Quite frankly, I think it would be kind of cool to have multiple avocado and citrus trees in my yard (like my Aunt has). And it is often sunny there. I have to go now.
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Why don't you join us here in Australia.
Same language, same McDonalds, same weather.
Less people, less violence, less pollution
Higher average standard of living
A government that wants skilled foreign workers.
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Why don't you join us here in Australia.
Australia?
Same language, same McDonalds, same weather.
McDonald's.
Less people, less violence, less pollution
Fewer people.
A government that wants skilled foreign workers.
... Makes Jack a dull boy?
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Actually, I did mull that over somewhat in that some of the Civilian military jobs I looked at were in Perth and Melbourne.
I talked to a recruiter at HMSA today and he's got my resume under consideration for interview for a new position there managing new pharmacy programs.
Downsides: 20% pay cut (expected), it's a one-year position with their option to continue it
Upsides: flex schedule (6 am-2:30 pm), stay in Hawaii, gain some new skills that will be marketable in looking for Federal healthcare management jobs, stay in Hawaii. The schedule will allow us to further explore a business idea we have which is keen.
I just don't know if it makes sense to take a job relatively quickly when I've probably got as much as six months (in terms of money) to look around. But, I haven't been offered that job so at this point, I'm just speculating.
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Some yes and some no - since we just had a kid, I can request and get 12 weeks of FMLA and since I have that much sick time, I can take it and get paid. That's not bankable - but cashing in my vacation and the smallest and most useless of the retirement funds would give us like about 10K in cash.
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...since we just had a kid...would give us like about 10K in cash.
Is anyone else thinking Baby Bling? Aloha, don't let all that ice go to your head! Save some for a rainy day!
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I've come up with a plan. Take the 10k, invest in some of that famous killer island weed, move to LA, and sell for 10x profit.
~Paul
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At least he posted the low security Fed lockup.
Interesting plan, though. NORML needs to come through with some legislation, man.
'Zack, that;s not baby bling. That's what I have to show for 14 years of Fed service. Well, and the nest egg in the larger retirement plan. But anyhow, it doesn't seem like much to me given what I've put in.
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The current plan:
Ok, for those of you still interested -
I'm waiting for orders posting me to Los Angeles. My understanding is that I can decline those orders and rather than be fired or having to quit, the government has to process my separation as a RIF (reduction in force).
This way, I get 16 weeks of severance pay, I'm pretty sure I qualify for unemployment, I can still cash in my vacation time, and I can get a hiring preference for any Federal jobs here in Hawaii.
so 280 hours of vacation cashed out, another 640 hours of severance - that works out to 23 weeks of pay. Plus unemployment.
That's almost half a year to find a job or start a business or surf or whatever.
Also, I had a job interview just this morning with HMSA and they seem to really like my resume's fit with a job they have. It pays 55-60K. If I were to start that job in, say, May, still get the 23 weeks of pay I actually come out ahead on the year AND I could get another Fed job that is here permanently (and take my time looking for the right job).
This could work out OK. I'm keeping my fingers crossed and waiting for some of you mooks to come out and visit. Cause I might have a month there with nothing better to do.
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Sounds like you got it all figured out Dawg. Good goin' Buddy.
~Paul
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Hooray!
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I'm glad to hear that you've decided to let them let you go. Half a year, paid in full, for not showing up... sounds like a plan. And if you find anything sooner, then you're doubling up for a bit.
Awesome. Glad to hear that even if you aren't getting a fair shake at work at least you can shake something decent for yourself.
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Los Angeles is an awesome wealth of art, music, Western-American culture and mellow atmosphere. I'd love to live there. When people mouth off about L.A., they're really thinking of Orange County, which is where McDonald's was invented. Many L.A. enclaves have that fine bohemian vibe.
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Unfortunately, I have little exposure to LA except for that which is portrayed in film, song and the mainstream media.
Somewhere between Steve Martin's "LA Story" (which I love), the movies "Colors" or "Training Day" or "Falling Down", the mainstream portayal of California politics and the smog report lies the truth.
The culture and energy would eclipse Hawaii easily. It's not the easiest decision to make so it comes down to how many times do I want to tell my almost 6-year old daughter that we are going to make new friends far away.
I'd prefer to put that off as much as possible.
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You think I'm getting back into this discussion?
I'm not getting back into this discussion.
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Somewhere between Steve Martin's "LA Story" (which I love), the movies "Colors" or "Training Day" or "Falling Down", the mainstream portayal of California politics and the smog report lies the truth.
I saw Collateral a bit ago, and it almost made up my mind for me on where to live after school (it's down to Seattle, Vancouver, Northern or Southern California). The first half or so reminded me of why I love the place.
*****Minor Spoler*****
The end was Tom Cruise as Terminator.
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Yeah, Michael Mann should do tourist films for the L.A. board of tourism. Many of his films are set in L.A. and no one makes the city look beautiful like Mann does.
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When people mouth off about L.A., they're really thinking of Orange County, which is where McDonald's was invented.
Dear Mr 'stad:
You're so full of shit you squeek. Fuck you in the neck, sideways twice.
Yours Truly,
Asherdan
PS: Cockknocker
I'd like to add that the first McDonalds is in Des Plaines, Illinois and it's still open.
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Yeah, Michael Mann should do tourist films for the L.A. board of tourism. Many of his films are set in L.A. and no one makes the city look beautiful like Mann does.
As far as I know, the only Mann film I've seen is Heat, but LA looked appealing in that. I mean, even the crime didn't scare me off, as at least it was intelligent crime. I can respect that!
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Yeah, Michael Mann should do tourist films for the L.A. board of tourism. Many of his films are set in L.A. and no one makes the city look beautiful like Mann does.
As far as I know, the only Mann film I've seen is Heat, but LA looked appealing in that. I mean, even the crime didn't scare me off, as at least it was intelligent crime. I can respect that!
Heat is beautiful AND good. It is one of my favorites.
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Go Asherdan! A SoCal defender even more caustic than me. Beautiful!
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Just to drag this back on topic, it's still pretty unlikely I will be moving to LA.
However, I am looking at a potential setback. I may have signed a mobility clause 13 years ago, and even if I didn't, they may be able to use the 'intent of the position' argument to deny me the opportunity to collect severance and/or unemployment by forcing me to choose between resignation and termination. This would also deny me the potential for priority placement for Federal Jobs here. This costs me at least 16K, makes it slightly harder to get a Federal Job (impossible if they terminate me) and basically burns my ass.
It also works toward making me even less likely to go where they tell me - I don't like being treated like a piece of equipment.
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Re: Burgers in Orange County. (http://www.snopes.com/crime/cops/burger.asp)
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Yeah, for someone being so totally messed with, you're really being a pretty cool guy about it. You are CHILL.
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I got God on my side. It helps a lot. Y'all know when the preacher talks about the "Peace that passeth all understanding"? I'm 1% of the way there.
Also, I'm in Hawaii which makes complaining about ANYTHING besides painful terminal illness seem kind of ridiculous.
It will work out, no matter what. I know it.
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Shantih. Shantih. Shantih.
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Y'all know when the preacher talks about the "Peace that passeth all understanding"? I'm 1% of the way there.
Ha. Maybe when I'm 100 years old I'll get that far... Good for you.
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Belated good wishes, 'Dawg. I'm soon to be jobless too, so I'll keep pulling for both of us.
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Hawaii needs quality teachers really badly; special ed teachers even more badly.
Someone suggested that I could be a teacher here. I have no training at all. It seems like the fact that this suggestion was made sincerely and could actually work seems to me to be part of the problem.
Well, that and the really shitty pay.
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Someone suggested that I could be a teacher here. I have no training at all. It seems like the fact that this suggestion was made sincerely and could actually work seems to me to be part of the problem.
I disagree. I think we need more dedicated, intelligent and creative teachers. The training is secondary at best.
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All true. So they would start me at around 30K to work 9 months. Can't really argue with the benefits or Union Protection.
The bigget problem I have is the whole 'teaching to tests' thing. That and I've met and talked to teachers here individually and they are so far apart in terms of philosophy, in terms of 'no child left behind', in terms of what they feel needs to happen that it's almost scary to contemplate jumping into that pool.
I appreciate that training is probably secondary to really wanting to do the job, but this environment seems to grind that sincere desire out of an awful lot of teachers.
That and the pay is not so good (< 50% of my current pay) and what would I do with the summer? And wouldn't the new guy get dropped into some hellish place with all Samoan 4th graders who are bigger than I am?
Mr Kotter I'm not.
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The bigget problem I have is the whole 'teaching to tests' thing.
what would I do with the summer?
My mom's been a teacher for about 30 years now and she hates the tests. If the kid has to pass an SOL (Standards of Learning) test to advance to the next grade she has no choice but to teach the material covered on the test. Which is annoying when that means spending time on "Dwellings of Native Americans" when she should be introducing the concept of multiplication.
Also, depending on your school system the "summer off" translates into 1 month, not 3. Plus the fact that the days are 7:30–10 (again, depending on grade).
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I'm teaching in a school that's 99% free and reduced lunch kids (translation: really really damn poor), so my experiences aren't really standard, but I can say for sure that this has been the hardest damn thing I will ever do. 12 hour work days, constant disrespect (even to the point of violence) from students and parents, with no support from administration. And then there's the tests. I could teach to the test just fine, but not when half the 8th grade is cutting class to go smoke pot and have sex in the bathrooms with no consequences whatsoever. It's truly maddening. Oh, and we have 4 unions, none of which do a damn thing.
Some of the little knuckleheads are truly amazing though. If it weren't for them, I would have broken my contract ages ago. I don't regret joining up for a minute, though I can't imagine doing it any more.
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Yeah, if there's one thing I'd caution -- teaching is not exactly an easy job to just drop into. My mom's a career special-ed teacher, and between lesson plans, IEPs, and classroom time, she works like a dog. Furthermore, while I agree that training is secondary, for special ed it is fairly important that you actually know something about the kids you're dealing with. (LD? BD? Mixed classes? My mom's current job, which appears to be "kids the classroom teachers don't want to deal with at the moment?")
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It's more-or-less the last option. Aside from the learning, which I know I can handle, it's ten years to get vested in the retirement system here.
And you wonder how it is that Hawaii comes in behind Arkansas, Louisiana and Mississippi in the rankings......
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My girlfriend is in her first year of teaching special education here in the Commonwealth. V's mother's work-day sounds a lot like her's. She also has the fun of dealing with parents who really think their MR kid belongs in "normal" classes, having a number of students who have made threats to her, etc. My girlfriend teaches, my best friend is wrapping up her student teaching this semester, and my sister is lining up her ducks to get into teaching. And I would rather be unemployed and living off Welfare than switch places with any of them. It's a thankless, stressful job, and I have mounds of respect for those that enter the field.
Me, I'll keep playing with airplanes for a little while.
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i would like to clarify my previous comments inre: teaching and the skills needed etc as based upon my own "learning" experiences and in no way shape or form related at all to reality.
in other words, i was not speaking of "specialized" teaching and or teachers, but, like, teachers of junior high algebra and etc.
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i would like to clarify my previous comments inre: teaching and the skills needed etc as based upon my own "learning" experiences and in no way shape or form related at all to reality.
in other words, i was not speaking of "specialized" teaching and or teachers, but, like, teachers of junior high algebra and etc.
Well, even junior-high algebra teachers (and "general" elementary-school teachers and such) need to have some skills that don't necessarily come with knowledge of their subjects: how to manage a classroom, quell disruptive behaviors with as little further class disruption as possible, keeping students at many levels of learning interested, quelling riots, &c. A lot of that comes with experience, but it also means that not everyone who remembers the material can be a capable teacher right out of the box. (My dad's learning that right now; he recently started teaching history at the Louisiana state honors high school, and his class-management skills are rocky, to say the least. He's a brilliant man with a Ph.D. in history, but he's just not used to dealing with a classroom of 20 squirrelly high-school kids.)
Anyway, special ed seems to get it hard, just because so many of the teachers going into it have this starry-eyed ideal of working with "special children" (read: the perfect Down-syndrome angels inexplicably popular in schmaltzy movies) and seem very shocked when they run into LD kids (many of whom are of average or higher intelligence and often frustrated), kids with severe behavioral disorders, MR kids who aren't easy to deal with, and so on... people seem to be relatively well-acquainted with the difficulties of teaching in general by now, but the idea that special ed is very hard seems to have somehow slipped the collective mind.
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Okay, so now the real decision is at hand.
I have been offered a position at HMSA. It pays 14K less than what I make now as an overpaid Fed. I don't get severance as it turns out because I did in fact sign a mobility agreement in August 1991, before I even started.
I have agreed in principle to start in Mid May if I accept the position. I assume that health insurance will be free, that saves me $130.00 every two weeks. So $3400 on health insurance and whatever the balance on that loan is, call it $2500 and there is $6,000, a little less than half of the difference.
Elinor wants to take a disbursement from my 401K and pay off all of our revolving debt, under the assumption that we would save multiple thousands of dollars on interest alone over the course of a year. It would require us to disburse at least 1/3 of the total, probably closer to half, and take those penalties.
The question I have is: is this a good idea or not? Why or why not?
Has anyone had to do this before that can tell me how it works out?
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I wish I could help, but the only option I've ever had in these situations is 6 in one hand 1/2 dozen in the other. It sucks to have to choose between the lesser of two evils. That (dis)honor should be reserved for electing our public officials.
~Paul
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Well, taking the money out of your 401K is theoritically a good idea IFF you can and will repay it. Look at it this way: you're paying (some what optomistically) say 12% on your credit card debt. On a balance of $5000 that's $600 per year you're paying a credit card company. If you borrow from your 401K you'll have to repay it with interest. However, the interest you're paying is to yourself. So you're not completely giving up any return on that money and you're not paying some evil-ass credit card company exorbitant rate of interest.
However, if you don't or can't pay your 401K back the IRS will nail your ass to the wall with penalties and the the taxes you didn't pay when the 401K funds were withheld from your paycheck. Of course, if you're paying a usurous enough interest rate you may be better off even if you do get nailed by the IRS.
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Well, taking the money out of your 401K is theoritically a good idea IFF you can and will repay it.
I just love that this is the type of forum where somebody can say IFF and not feel the need to explain it.
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Well, taking the money out of your 401K is theoritically a good idea IFF you can and will repay it.
I just love that this is the type of forum where somebody can say IFF and not feel the need to explain it.
I found this very pleasing as well. I was also pleased that you pointed it out.
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I'm just happy I remember what it means.
Good advice, Aug, but unfortunately it wouldn't be as a loan, it would be as a disbursement since they won't be my employers anymore and I can't really pay back in. So it's the reaming I don't want take.
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Why did you put money into your 401K? If it was to "save" money, then take the money out and do whatever you want with it.
However, if you put it in so that you could retire, DO NOT EVER EVER touch that money.
I assume by "Revolving Debt" you mean credit cards, or mostly credit cards. Credit card debt SUCKS. However, it is possible to pay it off. I can tell you, i would MUCH rather be paying of my cc debt AND have money in a retirement account than just paying off cc debt.
There are so many ways to dance the "paying off the cc dance". keep balance transferring to no or low interest cards, get a second mortgage (now would be the time. if i were a betting man, and someone asked me to put money down, i'd have to say i'd bet that interest rates are going up), "cinch" the belt a bit tighter, etc, etc, etc.
In my chair from a bajillion miles away, i would amateur psychoanalyze that the job change issue is causing all kinds of chaos and change and stress and etc. those things are the "saving for retirement" killer.
inre: repaying the 401K. if you, or anyone, is in a financial position wherein they "have" to take money out of their retirement savings in order to pay off creditors, etc, do you realistically think that once you take that money out of the retirement savings that there is any chance that money is going to go back in to replace it?
is taking the money out going to change the circumstances that caused the need to take the money out? sure, you pay off the revolving debt. but are the circumstances that caused the revolving debt gone?
Dawg, i, obviously, don't know your specifics. But i _do_ know that with a family to take care of, your decisions are going to be much more difficult and have a lot more repercusions. But if there's any way you can not mess with your retirement savings, please don't.
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Don't forget that taking money out of your 401K plan now means you have to pay taxes on it. It may seem helpful in the short run, but April 15 2006 you might have a nasty surprise, and need to pay a tax bill... with a credit card, maybe?
I'm with Ark, here: I think taking money out of a retirement plan before you're retired is a bad idea. We've played the game of juggling credit cards for some time now: get one of them 0% (or the lowest you're getting) intro-rate credit cards, transfer everything to that, and pay what you can. Then in a year or so when that intro rate expires, get another card with an intro rate, move the balance there, and cancel the previous one.
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I'm just happy I remember what it means.
Good advice, Aug, but unfortunately it wouldn't be as a loan, it would be as a disbursement since they won't be my employers anymore and I can't really pay back in. So it's the reaming I don't want take.
Well, yes you can pay it back it, it just wouldn't be by payroll deduction.
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I paid $1000 into a 401K while I was in college. The company went out of business, a practice which is de rigeur for small businesses that hire me. The president absconded with the 401K money. After hounding the Department of Labor for it for the following four years, a former co-worker finally pressured the former president to release the funds to us. I was forced to take a disbursement. This was good at the time. JL and I needed the money. Unfortunately, we needed the money too much to set aside the amount we would later be taxed on. Come tax time, I had to pay income tax plus a 10% penalty on the $1000. This was almost disasterous for us. I keep better care of my tax situation now, but it's easier now that I have steady employment.
I'd follow your instincts and calculate how much you'd pay in interest in the coming years, and put that against the amount you'd have to pay in taxes and penalties. You might want to pay an accountant of financial planner to go over the numbers with you to make sure there isn't something you're forgetting. The fee they charge will seem miniscule compared to having a good decision behind you. I feel so much better about life every time I talk with my accountant.
If you come out ahead by cashing out, it's a good idea. But I would wait until you have the new job for a month or two so you can asses how your month-to-month finances come together when the dust clears. This way you can make more informed calculations about how much money you can throw at your debt in a year.
Again, I'm sure you've already considered these things being more experienced and knowlegable than I, but I'd like to help if I can.
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Tomorrow is the last day here before 6 weeks of paid "Family Medical Leave" during which I will be resigning. It's a pretty weird feeling.
May 15th I'm slated to start the new job. This is something I haven't really done in a long time - stepped into a completely new situation. Particularly one outside of the public sector.
It's getting weird around here.
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Weird can be good, though. I've always found starting new jobs to be exciting. Scary at times, but exciting and invigourating nonetheless.
Will we still see you here, AD? Can you access the board from home?
I hope so. Keep us appraised.
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Good luck and Godspeed, AD. May this adventure be a wonderful one for you and your family.
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My 2 1/2 cents:
If my recent job-starting experience is any indication, weird is definitely the word. I think this is normal and doesn't have long-term relevance. I hope.
My husband, who likes his relatively new job, says it took at least a month to get to like it. So if you don't get instant gratification - also, perhaps not a long term problem.
New is hard. Stupid little things are a constant pain - you don't know the basic things like where to find pens and how to work the copy machine, etc etc etc. It's more draining than you might think, but it gets better.
Hang in there. (And I'll try to do the same.) Good luck!
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Weird can be good, though. I've always found starting new jobs to be exciting. Scary at times, but exciting and invigourating nonetheless.
Will we still see you here, AD? Can you access the board from home?
I hope so. Keep us appraised.
Once the harddrive problem gets resolved, I'll be posting. I can also post from my US Gubmint Laptop til they make me send it back.
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dude, take the laptop and run!
Seriously, I wish you the best. If you need further encouragement as to why staying in Hawaii is a good thing I'll happily keep you posted on the horrors of winter in Manitoba!
Cheers!
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I want to thank all of you for your advice and support.
This is my third week at HMSA and it's not a calling but it pays the bills for now.
We met with some financial guys from John Hancock and gave up all the secrets of our sordid financial past and present. It was painful to look at all in one big picture, so I definitely advocate this to everyone. It will be OK and they think we can fanagle a disbursement from my government plan into an individual IRA which is a type which you can borrow from and take 30 years to pay yourself back, or something like that - that will get us a long way toward where we want to go.
So even though income is way, way down, we are actually happier than we've been in a long time and everything seems to be working out OK.
So again, thanks for all your kind and erudite posts - take your parting shots now, I'll close this thread in a few days since the crossroads are fading into the rearview mirror.