The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Trivial Pursuits => History => Topic started by: Arachno-capitalist on October 29, 2007, 06:25:30 pm
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21529255/ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21529255/)
According to Mississippi state law says a wife is the husband's property (one of seven states that still have the law on the book). So this guy is suing some multi-millionaire for "stealing" his wife. The basis is "alienation of affection". Homeboy wants to take this all the way to the Supreme Court. God Bless America.
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21529255/ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21529255/)
According to Mississippi state law says a wife is the husband's property (one of seven states that still have the law on the book). So this guy is suing some multi-millionaire for "stealing" his wife. The basis is "alienation of affection". Homeboy wants to take this all the way to the Supreme Court. God Bless America.
Anthony Robbins got sued by his gorgeous blonde wife's ex-husband on the premise that Mr. Robbins "stole her away". Alienation of affection was also a primary argument. The ex tried to commit suicide after Sage left him for Mr. Robbins and it was widely publicized, also because Mr. Robbins is such a self-help guru. She's not chattel, so the judge threw out the "stolen property" argument. I have no idea how this case will end up, though. It's not like the Robbins case set new legal precedent or anything.
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"Alienation of Affection" is totally my favorite Sunny Day Real Estate album.
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What? they don't have an album called that...
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But it should be. I think that's the point that's trying to be made here.
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yeah, I was pretty sure it was a joke.
come on, people, they are a good band. I like the music they make.
I get hell of dirty looks when I enter into conversations by saying something like "dude, I totally love emo!"
and slightly dirtier ones when I say "but, not what people call emo now..." and go into a big thing about post-hardcore and all that stuff.
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It was a joke, yes. But don't take that to mean that I don't like SDR! I basically do exactly what you mentioned in your third paragraph.
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I'm sorry but any form of music where you need more than one paragraph to coherently explain the genre and its title, it doesn't actually count as music. This is a rule I have. It is a very important rule.
"Post-hardcore"? Really? I... uh... no offense, my party-people but... no, sir, I don't buy it.*
*said in the voice of Mr. hoss from "Ren and Stimpy".
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damn, dude, who died and made you associate commisioner of what is music?
"Emo" comes from the phrase "Emotional Hardcore," referring to the late-80's development of hardcore punk into a style with more complex guitar parts (often including 2 guitarists) and less screaming. Takes a lot of influence from punk, but also introduced new conventions. Later developments were more influenced by pop-punk, becoming a more popularized form, while other groups took their cues from more experimental rock groups like Slint.
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One only need listen to Hot Water Music's "Fuel For the Hate Game" to see that post-hardcore is capable of kicking serious ass.
Edit: Genre labels are pretty stupid, though. By and large.
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There is a great lineage of music-snobbery attached to the Y-chromosome that my grandfather passed onto all of his male descendants. If I was born with telepathy, would you expect me to not use it, just because not many people have it? Of course not.
We're just good at it, is all.
Also, it is not that I am saying that some of the bands grouped under a genre label might not be good. I am sure that a few of them are, even in the weirdest named genres.
But if your genre is called something like "post-shoegaze-core-shlemezel-schlamazel-hossenpheffer-incorporated-core"... and you make good music? You are definitely the exception and not the rule.
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dude, post-hardcore is not that complicated of a name.
I mean, really, this just comes from the fact that nowadays we have recorded music, so we are more aware of a particular music's history.
as opposed to, you know, thinking that Folk Music just sprung out of the ground when God made Adam and gave him a banjo.
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(http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/2001819576783355739_rs.jpg)
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Well... explain to me the fashion in which it is post, for one, Nev.
How is it... after hardcore?
I have heard people play me "hardcore" and I have heard people play me "post-hardcore" and...
Whether I "like" or "dislike" the given sample, it all sounds like the same kind of music to me.
Dudes all purposely rejecting the idea of sounding like music because it is a movement a lot more about the scene around the music than actually sounding like music, most of the time. The pose before the product. The massage before the message.
And maybe 10% of the time it is interesting, usually despite itself.
There... there basically isn't anything more antithetical to my point of view on the rock and roll music than the idea of "punk". Everyone can enjoy what they want and... totally penisltov to that... but anything where there is a PREMIUM put upon not really knowing how to tune or use the tools at hand is not my thing.
My Thing is getting so good at the tools at hand that you can go beyond them not... uhm... despite them.
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Who was it that said "Writing about music is like tap-dancing about architecture."
Genre labels are pretty much meaningless to me. Music is either good or it isn't, no matter what category you try to force it into. I suppose genres can be useful if you want to find music similar to something you already like. But otherwise, I don't care what you call it.
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Who was it that said "Writing about music is like tap-dancing about architecture."
Genre labels are pretty much meaningless to me. Music is either good or it isn't, no matter what category you try to force it into. I suppose genres can be useful if you want to find music similar to something you already like. But otherwise, I don't care what you call it.
My favorite genre will always be Tis távlas - the drinking songs of ancient Epirus. Or the Sygyt style of Xoomii school Tuvan throat singing.
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oh man, LFM, our ideas about what makes good rock music are so at odds that I will just concede that we are always going to disagree on this.
when I was in 10th grade, I was obsessed with Led Zeppelin. And I used to listen to Whole Lotta Love over and over... but not the whole song. I'd just fast-forward to the point like 3:00 minutes in where the guitars get all crunchy and nuts and he plays the solo. Then I'd rewind to 3 minutes again, then listen to it again. I did this with a lot of songs. Find the 5 seconds which were the most intense, and listen to it over and over.
Then my friend Sarah told me to check out The Velvet Underground, and then The Ramones, and it all kind of went on from there.
Now when I get in that kind of mood, I just listen to something like "Don't Try to Call" by Husker Du. It's exactly a minute and thirty seconds long, and that entire time span is just intense guitar chords and crazy drums and yelling.
I mean, I like a lot of other kinds of music, but this is the music that really grabs me. I love some insane guitar solos and crazy complex jazz stuff and all, but... I dunno, man.
I also have a tendency to describe things I absolutely love in terms that make people think they're horrible.
"man, it's just... it's just a bunch of teenage guys playing their instruments as fast as they can for a minute and then stopping!"
"man, I love my guitar! it's really sharp sounding, and kind of crunchy, and half the buttons don't work, and it's sound doesn't really fit into most kinds of music..."
"oh man, (name) is such a cool chick! she's like, kind of socially awkward and overenthusiastic, and phrases things in weird ways, and is built like an adolescent boy, and she's a sociology major! that's like the department of being too liberal about stuff! plus, she makes really insane abstract art!"
"I love listening to LPs! They're all old and scratchy, and they're a pain to listen to, and you can't skip songs!"
"Dude, I just paid 7 dollars for this 45... and it only has 2 songs on it! and one is horrible!"
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Inev has just described the formula for how DJs evolved scratching as an art form. In another life, DJ Inev would make the rudest remixes of rock guitar.
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There... there basically isn't anything more antithetical to my point of view on the rock and roll music than the idea of "punk". Everyone can enjoy what they want and... totally penisltov to that... but anything where there is a PREMIUM put upon not really knowing how to tune or use the tools at hand is not my thing.
I don't know what "punk" is. I've been around a lot of arguments about whether a certain band is or is not "punk". It always seemed to me that the folks involved were more interested in talking about it than listening to it.
But what you're describing, Inev, I have no problem with. You like what you like and you listen to what you think is good. That's what it's all about. Good music is good music no matter what you call it.
I think you and LFM are talking about two different things. You use "Post-hardcore" (or whatever it was) as a label for a set of music that you like. LFM has criticized the idea of post-hardcore, or any hyphenated genre -- not the actual music you like. I tend to agree with LFM that when a genre defines itself in terms of another genre (i.e. post-whatever, anti-this, neo-that) it is usually so self-conscious and removed from raw creativity that good product is seldom produced.
If I, as an artist, am defining myself as a "Post-Whateverist", I'm probably worrying too much about critics and genres and not enough about the work. That's not to say that if a critic calls my work "Post-Whatever" it can't be good.
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Okay, let's... let's not delve into the "All punk bands can't play instruments and are all about the sceeeene" canard. And let's also not act like these "post-hardcore" bands went around calling themselves that like some badge of honor, neglecting the fact that it was music journalists in desperate need of a way to describe them without confusing readers with a brand new word.
And August is right: genre labels are mostly terrible. Music is a goddamned dirty, disgusting underground root system with millions of branching paths, constantly growing and evolving. Tagging a genre with a certain label is a fool's errand when every band is basically tangled in a web of inspiration incomprehensibly complex.
To use a shitty metaphor.
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Basically, what I'm saying... beyond my personal tastes (wherein, yeah, the vast majority of punk DOES sound like that to my ears, but if you dig it, I'm glad you dig it) it's...
Basically the whole "post" thing.
I can wrap my head around the idea of "hardcore". It's not my thing but I basically get it.
But the difference between "hardcore" and "post-hardcore" I am boggled at.
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see, to me the two sound very different?
I am not kidding.
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Music is for listening to, not arguing about.