The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Achewood => Achewood => Topic started by: doomglobe on November 26, 2003, 07:29:15 am
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was originally aired on serializer a year ago. interesting.
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Monday!?!?!?
How long is Thanksgiving goddamnt?
Oh well, I guess after the run we've had he deserves a break.
Crack open a bottle and chill for the weekend O'.
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was originally aired on serializer a year ago. interesting.
That was a 'repeat'? Bit underwhelming - oh well, news to me as a non-serializer-er. I think the shift to something colourful will help arrest any possible trauma that may be suffered otherwise.
The preceding story has to go down as one of the greatest in achewood's (delightful) history. So some fridge-magnet-style things are a nice return to the sublime and odd. As opposed to the the sublime and tragic.
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Meh... It seems especially underwhelming as a canadian- the fact that our thanksgiving's already well over just makes this feel like a very sketchy excuse.
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I do say underwhelming as an upstanding citizen of the United Kingdom - so some regionalisation would be nice (aside from the previous asiatic excursion)
A Guy Fawkes achewood would be great (and anti-British Government, which I'm all for). Just imagine... Philippe trying to hold a sparkler.
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A Guy Fawkes achewood would be great (and anti-British Government, which I'm all for). Just imagine... Philippe trying to hold a sparkler.
"Hey, now, Philippe, blowing up the Underground House of Parliament isn't rad!" says Ray, and then they hug, and then Beef dies somehow?
I liked the Thanksgiving thing; it was brightly-colored, surreal, and sort of cute, and (to quote NBC) it was "new to me," so.
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Meh... It seems especially underwhelming as a canadian- the fact that our thanksgiving's already well over just makes this feel like a very sketchy excuse.
-a sketchy excuse to ignore the massacre of North America's Aboriginal people? Oh wait, you meant the strip not Thanksgiving, right.
(edit: sweet jesus, i'm bitter.)
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Seriously, Urban Outfitters needs to carry this magnet pack.
Actually, I always imagined an Achewood Thanksgiving like this: Phillipe has to make Thanksgiving dinner, but being a child all he knows how to prepare is popcorn and toast with sides of jellbeans and pretzels.....
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Meh... It seems especially underwhelming as a canadian- the fact that our thanksgiving's already well over just makes this feel like a very sketchy excuse.
-a sketchy excuse to ignore the massacre of North America's Aboriginal people? Oh wait, you meant the strip not Thanksgiving, right.
(edit: sweet jesus, i'm bitter.)
No no no, you're thinking of Columbus day.
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Naw, Teador likes to cook too much to make Philippe do it. He might let him get the cranberry jelly out of the can, though.
I didn't expect strips tomorrow or Friday but I'm sad that I can't see the new products until Friday now. Stupid Black Friday even invading online retailers
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am i the only one that doesnt get this?
there's all these text bubbles but they don't belong to anyone
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am i the only one that doesnt get this?
there's all these text bubbles but they don't belong to anyone
They're all magnets. You arange the characters aroudn with the speech bubbles to make your own Achewood comic on your fridge. If you have any Magnetic Poetry you can make them say all kinds of crazy new things
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Naw, Teador likes to cook too much to make Philippe do it. He might let him get the cranberry jelly out of the can, though.
That is such a fun job but I am afraid Phillipe will not get to do it, surely they would make it from scratch. All you have to do is boil cranberries and sugar and water. Teodor's a guy who brines meats and carmelizes his own onions - he wouldn't stand for canned cranberry sauce.
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Meh... It seems especially underwhelming as a canadian- the fact that our thanksgiving's already well over just makes this feel like a very sketchy excuse.
Speaking of Canadians and cranberries - all the cranberries I could find to buy were from Canada. What happened to good old American ones from Massachusetts? How can I celebrate Thanksgiving with Canadian cranberries? Just another way you sly northerners are infiltrating the fabric of our nation...
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What happened to good old American ones from Massachusetts?
Frickin' environmentalists (based in Vermont, no doubt) making us get rid of the bogs so that obscure giraffe can swim upriver.
It was fun seeing the magnets again (and rearranging them in my head--this is a repeat that is better than nothing at all (or rather, having just the Tuesday panel sitting there until Monday).
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Considering for at least 6 mnths out of the year all our produce comes from outside the country it's exciting to here that our Cranberries have infultratied your country. Next it will be apples, then potatos. Good. Good! Ha, ha, haaa!
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Actually, I always imagined an Achewood Thanksgiving like this: Phillipe has to make Thanksgiving dinner, but being a child all he knows how to prepare is popcorn and toast with sides of jellbeans and pretzels.....
It's been done, Charlie Brown.
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Naw, Teador likes to cook too much to make Philippe do it. He might let him get the cranberry jelly out of the can, though.
That is such a fun job but I am afraid Phillipe will not get to do it, surely they would make it from scratch. All you have to do is boil cranberries and sugar and water. Teodor's a guy who brines meats and carmelizes his own onions - he wouldn't stand for canned cranberry sauce.
Yeah but canned cranberry jelly is such a kid food that you usually have in addition to the real cranberry sauce for the adults. Plus I could see Philippe sitting there like an hour being very careful trying to gently extrude it in one unbroken tube of pectiny tartness.
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Dang, these Canadian cranberries are DIFFERENT. They're bigger. They better taste the same. If you people ruin my Thanksgiving...
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Yeah but canned cranberry jelly is such a kid food that you usually have in addition to the real cranberry sauce for the adults.
Could be... but then, will they make him sit at the kids' table all by himself? That would be the saddest thing.
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The kids' table will obviously consist entirely of Phillippe and Little Nephew. Which may well be sadder even than Phillippe sitting by himself.
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Meh... It seems especially underwhelming as a canadian- the fact that our thanksgiving's already well over just makes this feel like a very sketchy excuse.
-a sketchy excuse to ignore the massacre of North America's Aboriginal people? Oh wait, you meant the strip not Thanksgiving, right.
(edit: sweet jesus, i'm bitter.)
We need to have an "Manifest Destiny Day",
If you want to put a sharp point on it. I remember when I was in grade school we were allowed to
1) say the word Indian when not referring to someone named Rajiv
2) play cowboys and indians
3) trace our hands, cut them out and make indians (along with turkeys)
4) sit "Indian Style" (no longer a concept; my daughter sits "criss cross applesauce" in pre-school
5) hang up Indian Corn
6) enjoy a glorious indian summer day in October or November
etc. etc.
Now I can't get the song Cherokee People out of my head. And although the message is pretty clear, it's actually kind of a shitty song in terms of it's execution.
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The kids' table will obviously consist entirely of Phillippe and Little Nephew. Which may well be sadder even than Phillippe sitting by himself.
Phillippe all playing and admiring the Turkey cutout he made by tracing around his hand and colored;
Little Nephew all glowering and cussin' Ray under his breath and throwing olives.
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All sticking olives on their fingertips, all picking out the skins from the whole berry cranberry sauce (everyone knows the jellied is better), all dumping huge amounts of mini-marshmellows on top of their candied yams, all smothering the white meat and stuffing with gravy, all sneaking sips of wine from various adults' glasses, all snickering and throwing rolls at each other when the grown-ups aren't looking, all wishing they could go to McDonalds for Thanksgiving, all not being thankful for SQUAT, all wonderin' about buckles on shoes and hats, all fighting over whether football or cartoons should be playing on the big console furniture TV, the only TV the family owns, all getting stuffed and falling asleep on the floor of the family room while our parents play pinochle in the kitchen.
Or am I just old?
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All sticking olives on their fingertips, all picking out the skins from the whole berry cranberry sauce (everyone knows the jellied is better), all dumping huge amounts of mini-marshmellows on top of their candied yams, all smothering the white meat and stuffing with gravy, all sneaking sips of wine from various adults' glasses, all snickering and throwing rolls at each other when the grown-ups aren't looking, all wishing they could go to McDonalds for Thanksgiving, all not being thankful for SQUAT, all wonderin' about buckles on shoes and hats, all fighting over whether football or cartoons should be playing on the big console furniture TV, the only TV the family owns, all getting stuffed and falling asleep on the floor of the family room while our parents play pinochle in the kitchen.
Or am I just old?
Its things like this that make me thankful to be an only child, who grew up with few family members within an 800 mile radius. No need for a kids table when it's only you and the folks.
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All sticking olives on their fingertips, all picking out the skins from the whole berry cranberry sauce (everyone knows the jellied is better), all dumping huge amounts of mini-marshmellows on top of their candied yams, all smothering the white meat and stuffing with gravy, all sneaking sips of wine from various adults' glasses, all snickering and throwing rolls at each other when the grown-ups aren't looking, all wishing they could go to McDonalds for Thanksgiving, all not being thankful for SQUAT, all wonderin' about buckles on shoes and hats, all fighting over whether football or cartoons should be playing on the big console furniture TV, the only TV the family owns, all getting stuffed and falling asleep on the floor of the family room while our parents play pinochle in the kitchen.
Or am I just old?
Its things like this that make me thankful to be an only child, who grew up with few family members within an 800 mile radius. No need for a kids table when it's only you and the folks.
This makes me sad.
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All sticking olives on their fingertips, all picking out the skins from the whole berry cranberry sauce (everyone knows the jellied is better), all dumping huge amounts of mini-marshmellows on top of their candied yams, all smothering the white meat and stuffing with gravy, all sneaking sips of wine from various adults' glasses, all snickering and throwing rolls at each other when the grown-ups aren't looking, all wishing they could go to McDonalds for Thanksgiving, all not being thankful for SQUAT, all wonderin' about buckles on shoes and hats, all fighting over whether football or cartoons should be playing on the big console furniture TV, the only TV the family owns, all getting stuffed and falling asleep on the floor of the family room while our parents play pinochle in the kitchen.
But this made me happier.
And what is it about the buckles, anyway?
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I remember when I was in grade school we were allowed to
1) say the word Indian when not referring to someone named Rajiv
2) play cowboys and indians
3) trace our hands, cut them out and make indians (along with turkeys)
4) sit "Indian Style" (no longer a concept; my daughter sits "criss cross applesauce" in pre-school
5) hang up Indian Corn
6) enjoy a glorious indian summer day in October or November
etc. etc.
I seem to notice there's a sports team called The Red Skins, but no sports team called The Blackies, and also, at my local Canadian sovienier shop there are some extremly racist cupie dolls with feathers sticking out the top of their heads, and don't even get me started on Dreamcatchers...
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I remember when I was in grade school we were allowed to
1) say the word Indian when not referring to someone named Rajiv
2) play cowboys and indians
3) trace our hands, cut them out and make indians (along with turkeys)
4) sit "Indian Style" (no longer a concept; my daughter sits "criss cross applesauce" in pre-school
5) hang up Indian Corn
6) enjoy a glorious indian summer day in October or November
etc. etc.
I seem to notice there's a sports team called The Red Skins, but no sports team called The Blackies, and also, at my local Canadian sovienier shop there are some extremly racist cupie dolls with feathers sticking out the top of their heads, and don't even get me started on Dreamcatchers...
In Grade 12 at my highschool I saw the Librarian shredding a book called 'Reservations are for Indians'.
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I'm an only child too and Thanksgiving is always such a non-holiday at my house. It's just like any other day except we eat dinner at 3 instead of 5:30. Nobody cared about the Cowboys or Lions so we didn't even watch football unless one of them was playing the Skins.
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Thanksgiving eh... Yeah...
Ah well.
And I just helped edit a book about Aboriginal film making (mainly Canadian) with a whole section on the horror that was Dances With Wolves.
Remarkably interesting book, as was the speech given by Matthew Coon Come at our last conference (he is the current National Chief of the Assembly of First Nations). While it was a depressing speech in all, it was also depressing seeing the Canadian High Commission reaction to some of what was said, since the High Commissioner and his cronies come every year, as do the Quebec crowd.
Anyway. All this Thanksgiving crap is foreign to me.
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I seem to notice there's a sports team called The Red Skins, but no sports team called The Blackies, and also, at my local Canadian sovienier shop there are some extremly racist cupie dolls with feathers sticking out the top of their heads, and don't even get me started on Dreamcatchers...
Rad political writer Ward Churchill wrote a great essay (http://www.dickshovel.com/crimes.html) about this.
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If you want to put a sharp point on it. I remember when I was in grade school we were allowed to
1) say the word Indian when not referring to someone named Rajiv
2) play cowboys and indians
3) trace our hands, cut them out and make indians (along with turkeys)
4) sit "Indian Style" (no longer a concept; my daughter sits "criss cross applesauce" in pre-school
5) hang up Indian Corn
6) enjoy a glorious indian summer day in October or November
I was in Kindergarten only 8 years ago...and we did almost every one of those things. And most of the kindergarteners I know say 'indian style' etc.
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Really? It is hard to believe that this remote outpost in the pacific actual has some kind of "enlightenment advantage" over any other place in the US.
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Well, I DO live in Kansas...Hawaii's probably much more liberal.
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I seem to notice there's a sports team called The Red Skins, but no sports team called The Blackies, and also, at my local Canadian sovienier shop there are some extremly racist cupie dolls with feathers sticking out the top of their heads, and don't even get me started on Dreamcatchers...
Rad political writer Ward Churchill wrote a great essay (http://www.dickshovel.com/crimes.html) about this.
I was actually thinking of this essay when I mentioned the above. I was one of two aboriginal students at a highschool where our team was the "Warriors" and all team uniforms, school jackets and even my diploma had a stereotypical guy in a feathered head dress. It was so great to work so hard and get straight A's only to be reminded that I am actually a warring savage.
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An only child here, too. The big excitement of Thanksgiving was, well, eating early and getting to drink Kool-Aid out of the good glassware. (And always getting offered wine by the folks -- I wonder what they would have done had I accepted?)
The saddest thing is probably that the Achewood kids' table, even being just LN and Philippe, would still be nicer than the adults' table. Eventually LN would drop the persona and they would be all like talking about kid things, and meanwhile Lyle would be hitting Todd over the head with the stuffing server...
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oh man I slept like 14 hours after thanksgiving. (musta been the 3 or so bottles of wine I drank)
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I seem to notice there's a sports team called The Red Skins, but no sports team called The Blackies, and also, at my local Canadian sovienier shop there are some extremly racist cupie dolls with feathers sticking out the top of their heads, and don't even get me started on Dreamcatchers...
The essay was very interesting. Talk to me about the Dreamcatchers.
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I seem to notice there's a sports team called The Red Skins, but no sports team called The Blackies, and also, at my local Canadian sovienier shop there are some extremly racist cupie dolls with feathers sticking out the top of their heads, and don't even get me started on Dreamcatchers...
The essay was very interesting. Talk to me about the Dreamcatchers.
Well, dreamcatchers have a certain level of the sacred about them which you can research on your own, and I tend to be filled with a lot of misgivings at how they've been made "cute" and rendered into something made and sold at craft sales by people who tend to know very little about Aboriginal culture. There's a huge amount of over simplification all around and I find the fact that my ancestor's heritage is regularly turned into quaint decorations for the creativly impaired is extremely insulting and disrespectful. This is not to say that only Aboriginal people can understand or take knowledge from this spiritual realm. There was a mass genocide of my family enacted by the Candian government. I'm not talking about way back when Columbus and his gang arrived, I'm talking about my parents and even some of my own generation - my mom and one of my bestfriends were both taken from their parents and placed with European white families in a government institued attempt to anihalate our racial heritage this happened to thousands of Aboriginal families it was called "the scoop," and occured fromt he 60's strait through the 1980's. I grew up around some extremely damaged and self hating people, and like a lot of aboriginal people of my generation I tend to carry a great deal of sadness and feeling of loss about all this horrible history. Unfortunatly there are some reservations where molestation, rape and abuse are the norm - where the amount of violence once enacted from the outside has now turned inward. My bestfriend got beat up on the rez for being one of the only kids who WASN'T being molested.
With all the pain and loss that comes from what has occured in the very recent past, it's just hard to accept the scraps of my spiritual roots being sold to the uncomprehending masses be it dreamcatchers or sweetgrass. Just like 9/11 memorial souvenirs, the intent behind these things isn't nessisarily bad, but it's just not apropriate, it's a big raw gaping wound that can't be fixed with band-aids.
Like I said - don't get me started.
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Well, dreamcatchers have a certain level of the sacred about them which you can research on your own, and I tend to be filled with a lot of misgivings at how they've been made "cute" and rendered into something made and sold at craft sales by people who tend to know very little about Aboriginal culture.
I was told that Dreamcatchers, specifically, were pretty much made to be sold at craft sales. That they are analagous to "Chop Suey" a "Chinese" dish that was never actually made in China, but something that Chinese restaurants sold to Americans.
That is one of the reasons I was interested - you seem to be saying that I'm misinformed, that there is actual an authentic history behind dreamcatchers.
Doug
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[...] meanwhile Lyle would be hitting Todd over the head with the stuffing server...
Or, more in character, stuffing Todd into the turkey while Teodor is distracted with preparing the next course.
Todd: "H-h-h-ey, you b-b-b-better stop it, Lyl-mmmph!"
Lyle (yanking on Todd's tail): Looks like Teodor forgot to pluck the third turkey leg!
Mr. Bear: Lyle! Stop! Stop this instant[/]!"
Lyle: Shaddup, I'll put you in there, too, doilies 'n' all.
Todd: Mmmph!
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Smells wrote an interesting post about heritage and the loss of it above - it's interesting pondering what happened to the indigenous people of North America and living in Hawaii. Here many of the remaining aspects of a powerful spiritual culture is mass-produced and sold to Japanese and American tourists. In some ways it's one of the few ways that a displaced culture can rebuild it's cache in the modern era: charge for it.
Of course the misguided europeans don't understant the religious/spiritual aspect of Dream Catchers. Nor do they understand the language of Hula. Nor do they comprehend the thousands of years of history in the heiaus and giraffeponds of Hawaii and the rest of the Pacific. Hips and hand gestures and piles of stone to most people. That's sad in and of itself.
If a culture can preserve it's ways, educate it's young in them and make a little money which can return to benefit them, I think that may be a good as any place to start. I think it would be far worse if the only dreamcatchers in existence were in museums and only white people were around to look at them.
The forced diaspora of your people (the 'scoop' you described) sounds particularly horrible. I also find it horrible when non-aboriginal people engage in and profit from aboriginal culture. Add to the problems that you described high rates of depression, joblessness, alcoholism, drug use and disproportionate incarceration and your use of the term genocide seems more appropriate. I think that the culture and the language are both the roots and the fruit at this point, though. They can pull people together and give them the common footing they need to work together to build a more just society for themselves, and also at least in the short term, the culture can make some money to develop programs to continue the work those people do.
Although the sheer amount of money the Mormon church makes on Polynesian culture makes me sad, I also know of Native Hawaiian artisans and Hula teachers and Language specialists who are creating a contemporary Hawaiian culture. Rooted in the past and looking toward the future of Hawaii and Hawaiians. This is something I never saw in the Native American culture on the mainland. And I realize that history dealt the Native Hawaiians a different hand then the Native Americans but the idea that there was a future for the culture and the clear efforts to build toward it really are breathtaking. The balance of Sadness about what happened with Hope is beautiful. I saw so little hope on the mainland among Native Americans, mostly anger, and tragedy in terms of health, education, and opportunity. What happened here was not good; what is happening here could, I think, lead to a true renaissance of a contemporary, true Hawaiian culture for the Native Hawaiians.
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Well this thread sure went to shit.
~Paul
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Dreamcatchers are one of those things that were specific to a particular culture (in this case, the Objibwe/Chippewa), but have become incredibly debased into meaninglessness by commercialization. See also those "Lucky Buddha" figurines, which aren't the Gautama Buddha but actually Hotei, one of the Seven Immortals. Trouble is, people just dont care.
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Well this thread sure went to shit.
~Paul
I dunno, I honestly find it fairly fascinating. I'd chime in myself, but I don't have anything to share. That said... my sympathies to side-show (name intentionally botched) and others who have dealt with this.
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I also know of Native Hawaiian artisans and Hula teachers and Language specialists who are creating a contemporary Hawaiian culture. Rooted in the past and looking toward the future of Hawaii and Hawaiians. This is something I never saw in the Native American culture on the mainland. And I realize that history dealt the Native Hawaiians a different hand then the Native Americans but the idea that there was a future for the culture and the clear efforts to build toward it really are breathtaking. The balance of Sadness about what happened with Hope is beautiful. I saw so little hope on the mainland among Native Americans, mostly anger, and tragedy in terms of health, education, and opportunity. What happened here was not good; what is happening here could, I think, lead to a true renaissance of a contemporary, true Hawaiian culture for the Native Hawaiians.
There is a thrust to establish contemporary culture with Aboriginal Canadians too. I work amoung a great deal of artists both Aboriginal and not, and I can't deny the power of their work, but at the same time the machine of racism is very strong here because in Manitoba poverty is so high and the Aboriginal population is also much higher, so it's often frustrating, and the progress is pretty slow going. I'm writting a play about some of these issues right now so I'm thinking a lot about it. I think my last post sounding pretty depressing. Thanksgiving always gets me down. There is a great deal of hope and I'm optimistic for the future. Sometimes the work looks like a mountain.
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Thanksgiving always gets me down. There is a great deal of hope and I'm optimistic for the future. Sometimes the work looks like a mountain.
For me, in a far less direct way, it doesn't matter what time of year it is, it depresses me. Most things do of course...
Looking at some of the fiction and cinema coming from Aboriginals in both the Northern US and Canada recently says a lot about the state of things.
You've got Sherman Alexie and (sorry my connections to slow to check and I can't find the book right now but) the woman who wrote Monkey Beach, and the films related to both, which show both the effects of poverty, alcohol and the government on the idigenous populations.
Matthew Coon Come referred to the blockade of a road to stop the logging, and the back lash it received. It seems that it's OK for the government to state in reports that things are going terribly wrong, and that the kinds of indignities being forced upon people need be stopped, but the moment someone who isn't white, or prefers to not speak English (or French) stands up and tried to change something, it's no longer OK. I guess the point is that if they were given any leeway then they might get ideas of grandure and try to keep on changing things for the better.
We actually get to keep fairly up to date with Canadian Aboriginal media and art since one of the departments of BACS is a group of academics working on Aboriginal studies of various sorts.
And it's one of the things I'm greatful for as well. Including meeting, and seeing Coon Come's speech. It is an area of politics I am greatly interested in now, and what with my degree happening, it may be something I try to do something about actively in the next few years. In fact, I say may be, it will be if I get a chance.
But some of the cinema and fiction, for instance, that has come from First Nations Canada, has been superb. And I'm glad to have had a chance to get it.
I'd been trying to avoid this topic, what with my connections to the subject, and with my head being in entirely the wrong frame of mind to deal with deep discussion, but, well, I failed!
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That's so cool Slink, thanks for the input.
As for Aboriginal Film, I have to agree, there's been a lot of great stuff done. If you've seen practiacally any Canadian Aboriginal Film you've probably seen my friend Gloria May Eshkibok - She's written a book called Cyclops Beauty, 'cause she's only got one eye. She a big fat warm lady with a big fat warm heart. I got to act with her in my first professional gig, along with a great big group of other Aboriginal ladies in "Rez Sisters." She taught me about the concept of being "two spirited" which is one of the most interesting cultural attitudes toward homosexuality that I've ever heard of, and it's covered in this interview with her for those who are interested.
http:// http://www.yorku.ca/ycom/gazette/past/archive/2000/040500/issue.htm
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I think I have seen her, but not sure where. What with my memory being appalling.
As for Monkey Beach, I will plug it a little more since it was such a great book - http://www.iblist.com/book.php?id=2590 (in fact I was the one who added it to iblist!)
I'll check out that interview you posted as well. As well as scouring the York Uni page a little, since my boss just got a job there.
Might also be someone to ask to a conference. We've had a few authors across (Anita Rau Badami, Jeffrey Moore and the Winnipeg poets - Kroetsch (who was fantastically nice), Cooley and McCance) and an Inuit woman who (I forget her name and am not in the office) tours around performing traditional music, which was a remarkable piece, since all the songs contain these fantastic stories and histories.
Also, I'm headed to the Birkbeck conference in February, which is all about Canadian film, which will have a large segment on First Nations film. So that should be interesting, and if anyone wants any of the stuff I come away with, just say.
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if anyone wants any of the stuff I come away with, just say.
Holy Crap! Yes. Me. I do.
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Holy Crap! Yes. Me. I do.
Have written myself a little note!