The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Trivial Pursuits => Arts & Entertainment => Topic started by: pmcd9 on September 29, 2011, 04:57:55 pm
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My mother posted a link to this (http://www.godvine.com/8-Year-Old-Rhema-Marvanne-Sings-Hallelujah-Amazing-706.html) on her Facebook wall. I expected it to be the Hallelujah chorus and not the Lenard Cohen song.
I never thought of this song as being Christian in anyway even though it uses much Christian imagery.. Is this a case of not understanding what they are singing. Well obviously the little girl doesn't know, but her parents or whoever is pulling her strings is who I am referring to. Are they simply hearing what they want to hear, some vaguely religious words and a achingly beautiful melody, and ignoring what the song is really about. Or is it more complex than that?
I'm trying to be kind and not simply laugh at the dumb Christians getting it wrong again. On the one hand, who wouldn't love this song, it's one of the most beautiful songs ever written. On the other hand, I don't think I'd like to see it hijacked by Christians.
Would you guys care to help me sort out my mixed feelings about this?
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I couldn't get through past the first minute of overwrought eight-year-old-kid-wailing, but I know the song. I think of it as a secular tune, but Christianity has a long tradition of taking secular music and re-purposing it for worship.
The difference between a love song for another human being and a love song for a Deity is small, indeed. One of my favorite contemporary worship songs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbQSniiHOps) could easily, with a couple of word changes, be a secular love ballad. And as a Christian, I would not be offended if a popular artist took it and performed it as such -- though I imagine there are some Christians who would be.
Remember the song "Flood (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfAhpX_wIBk)?" It was played on our local "alternative" radio station, but Jars of Clay bills themselves as a Christian band (and in fact most of the other tracks on that album are overtly religious). It's all a matter of interpretation, and I'm all for people listening to music in whatever way speaks to them personally, regardless of the original artists' intent.
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I would like to make it illegal to record children singing. There are plenty of things you can't do till you are a grownup and I think this should be one of them.
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but...but... it's an eight year old with a speech impediment singing. It must be about Jesus!
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I'm not about to watch that. But did he sing this verse:
Well there was a time when you let me know
What's really going on below
But now you never show that to me do you?
And remember when I moved in you
And the holy dove was moving too
And every breath we drew was Hallelujah
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Two alternate versions of the tune that I really adore:
Instrumental (string trio): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_SZp_L3q4c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_SZp_L3q4c)
And its polar opposite, the all-female a capella version: http://www.myspace.com/takenoteladies (http://www.myspace.com/takenoteladies)
Both stunningly beautiful. Both routinely move me to tears, no matter how many times I hear them. It's kind of frightening.
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I would like to make it illegal to record children singing. There are plenty of things you can't do till you are a grownup and I think this should be one of them.
Children singing can be beautiful... when they are singing like children.
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The thing about Leonard Cohen is that much of his work draws correlation between the sacrid and the erotic, and this song does so... I read somewhere that Cohen said that after Rufus Wainright's cover of the song that he felt that it shouldn't be covered anymore because Wainright had done the best cover possible. Since the K.D. Lang version at the winter Olympics there has been another explosion of cover versions and Cohen is asking that people stop covering it, but no one seems to be listening.
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I would like to make it illegal to record children singing. There are plenty of things you can't do till you are a grownup and I think this should be one of them.
youre like that preacher/dad from 'footloose'.
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I'm especially partial to these kids (http://frontalot.untimelydeath.com/mycc//)
OK, I will make an exception for children who are trained to sing via beatings.
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Hey man, am I hallucinating again or are they putting out a remake of that thing?
i heard that lame news, as well.
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Hey man, am I hallucinating again or are they putting out a remake of that thing?
You're not! That's crazy.
I never thought of this song as being Christian in anyway even though it uses much Christian imagery
Seems really odd to me, too. He's Jewish and all of the references are to the Hebrew bible.
But yeah, people give songs their own meanings. Nothing new there.
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Hey man, am I hallucinating again or are they putting out a remake of that thing?
I've never seen that movie. I think this is one of those things that you all may remember as cool because you saw it when you were 12.
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I don't think anyone remembers it as cool, Paul. But this may be a thing that you would only know if you'd seen it. It also may be that I'm totally wrong.
Fuck that shit, anyway - they remade The Thing. That's wrong.
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What's next, Dirty Dancing?
Inevitably, yes.
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I'm pretty sure I saw a trailer for that recently? Are you guys just joking and know about this or am I making it up?
I can't find it so I guess I am making it up.
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there was a new/hip "dirty dancing" sequel made within the past 3-5 years. something about cuba...
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there was a new/hip "dirty dancing" sequel made within the past 3-5 years. something about cuba...
The movie is Dirty Dancing: Havana Nights (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0338096/) and Peter Sagal tells a really great story (http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/383/origin-story?act=3) about how he wrote the original draft of the script.
OK, I will make an exception for children who are trained to sing via beatings.
So I assume you are okay with this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3Q80mk7bxE) then?
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Ha. Yeah, I'd give them a pass. But you see the risk - you let the Jackson Five do their thing and you end up getting the Partridge Family.
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I saw Dirty Dancing for the first time when I was in my 30s and I actually called my Mom and thanked her for not letting me see it when I was in grade school like all my classmates. I was definitely not ready for the kind of awful that was going on in the background of that movie. I'm sure most of my contemporaries didn't have any idea what was going on with the abortion sub-plot, but when I watched it as an adult, it made me ill to consider how few options existed for women during that time and how sad and terrible everything was. I couldn't even get anything out of the semi-romantic main plot because even that seemed like a dead end, regardless of the outcome.
I didn't like it and it made me sad. This is why I stick to movies where stuff blows up and nobody ever has to talk about her feelings.
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And never, under any circumstances, watch Fame (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080716/).
Ha. Yeah, I'd give them a pass. But you see the risk - you let the Jackson Five do their thing and you end up getting the Partridge Family.
The line must be drawn here! This far and no further!
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...it made me ill to consider how few options existed for women during that time and how sad and terrible everything was. I couldn't even get anything out of the semi-romantic main plot because even that seemed like a dead end, regardless of the outcome. I didn't like it and it made me sad.
I'm glad I'm not the only person who took that away from the movie. All the plucky hijinks were hollow noise with that sword hanging over my head. I managed to avoid it until 1991 or so when the girls in the upstairs dorm were watching it and I was trying to make moves on them. Nothing like a little abortion chat to put ladies in the mood.
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I thought the abortion subplot was brilliant. You've got to understand, that movie was made during the era of Ronald Reagan when the country had taken a hard right turn. This movie, with it's veneer of good old fashioned Christian values appealed to all the little Alex P. Keaton's who had been seduced by Reagan. it showed them what it was like in this country before Roe Vs. Wade.
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I thought the abortion subplot was brilliant. You've got to understand, that movie was made during the era of Ronald Reagan when the country had taken a hard right turn. This movie, with it's veneer of good old fashioned Christian values appealed to all the little Alex P. Keaton's who had been seduced by Reagan. it showed them what it was like in this country before Roe Vs. Wade.
I get that, and I totally understand how it made a political point in a time when the political pendulum had swung hard right in most places. But first off, that lesson was mostly lost on girls my age, upper elementary aged kids at the time, who obsessed over the movie because they thought Patrick Swayze was Teh Hottness and internalized the message about bad boys being sexy and such.
Secondly, seeing it as an adult, I get how the subplot was brilliantly tied in, and I agree that it is good writing. But I also am the kind of person who can't watch Mad Men for the same reasons I hated Dirty Dancing. I've studied the time period extensively, specifically women's issues (and even more specifically, women's labor issues), and I know that things were actually even worse than they're depicted in such narratives, and I hate how the 50s and 60s are romanticized now. Even if the show is attempting to subtly point out how badly women were treated, the majority of the population is going to miss the subtlety and put Don Draper and his ilk on a pedestal. It makes me queasy just to think about.
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the fact that Don Draper is a piece of shit becomes less subtle over time. I think what I have taken away from the show is that part of what makes him great at his job is the same thing that makes him a horrible person. Which makes me feel... conflicted.
Just glad to find a picture of the haircut I have been trying to explain to barbers for a while now: (http://www.tvgasm.com/wp-content/uploads/IMG_0767.PNG)
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You could've just said you wanted the "Wesley Crusher".
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"Just give me a regular men's haircut, parted on the left, short on the sides and back. Like a longer high-n-tight." what's so tough about that?
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That is roughly what I have said in the past when I was given horrible haircuts. I guess it is more about how he styles it? The crap is meant for pretty short hair, I think.
People do this weird thing to my hair that makes it look like I have a receding hairline, even though I do not. They cut the bangs in a way that emphasizes my widow's peak to the point that it looks like Mr Spock a little bit.
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do you pay more than twelve dollars for your haircuts, because that does make a difference
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To veer somewhat closer to being on-topic, wombat, I wonder if you would also make an exception to your ban on children singing for these kids:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CPHnZV0K-k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CPHnZV0K-k)
(Stolen from GKA's G+ feed.)
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Yeah I saw that. Tough call.
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Yeah I saw that. Tough call.
Look at it this way. If they were adults you would see them as just a really crappy cover band.
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But it is funny that they are children. The problem is that it won't end there.
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No. It's still unbearable. Sorry. The singing ruins it. For me, this has always been the reason children should be allowed to sing publically. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlli9ci2DqU)
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This (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPG3zSgm_Qo) does it for me. I just realized that my dad is the exact right age to have been a singer in this choir-- actually he was an alto in church choir until his voice changed. Thinking about that, and this sad song, and all of the shitty stuff that would happen to my dad around this time period, is making me way too sad for this to be an 80 degree day with no Christmas in sight.
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No. It's still unbearable. Sorry. The singing ruins it. For me, this has always been the reason children should be allowed to sing publically. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlli9ci2DqU)
Oh no, not those guys again.
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No. It's still unbearable. Sorry. The singing ruins it. For me, this has always been the reason children should be allowed to sing publically. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlli9ci2DqU)
Eight year olds showing actual musicianship shredding away on a Metallica standby doesn't do it for you, but a bunch of towheads in leiderhosen singing about overcoming incontinence does?
I...I have not the words.
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Eight year olds showing actual musicianship shredding away on a Metallica standby doesn't do it for you, but a bunch of towheads in leiderhosen singing about overcoming incontinence does?
You gotta be kidding me, those pee pee kids were showing way more musicianship than the Metallica kids. And they weren't pretending to be adults so they definitely win big in this comparison.
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Question for the Americans, is Mini Pops (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9jX0XPv6IE&feature=related) only a thing in Canada? They were huge when I was a kid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKcmHwjfCbg&feature=related) and have continued cranking out shit cover albums since the early 80's.
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Question for the Americans, is Mini Pops (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9jX0XPv6IE&feature=related) only a thing in Canada? They were huge when I was a kid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKcmHwjfCbg&feature=related) and have continued cranking out shit cover albums since the early 80's.
Yikes!!!
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We have Kidz Bop (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAQKdgFZCGs). That is a cover of Float On by Modest c*ck (synced up with some live footage of Modest c*ck). Anyway, you get to hear a bunch of kids sing "I backed my car into a cop car the other day. YEAH!"
It's totally fucked.
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You gotta be kidding me, those pee pee kids were showing way more musicianship than the Metallica kids. And they weren't pretending to be adults so they definitely win big in this comparison.
I admit, I didn't make it all the way through the peepee video. They were shrieking into microphones and shuffling around like head trauma victims, I couldn't take it. The Metallica kids, though, were actually playing guitars and drums such that the original melody and style of the song was preserved. That's pretty impressive for a bunch of 8, 9, and 10 year olds. How well did you play the guitar when you were 8?
Sure, the Mini Metallica's front man was a bit shrill, but even he was doing his best to be a showman and not just a singer. And as for kids pretending to be adults, I'll take that over an excessively precious ditty about bodily fluids any day.
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That is a cover of Float On by Modest c*ck (synced up with some live footage of Modest c*ck).
I haven't had a chance to click on any of the links since my last post, and I am enjoying the filter so much here, I hate to ruin the thread by actually listening to any of that music.
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modest cock is all, "i may not belong to a farm animal, but i get the job done."
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This One (http://www.godvine.com/9-Year-Old-Boy-Sings-Amazing-Grace-My-Chains-are-Gone-742.html) is just for you Wombat.
I watched the entire thing. I was intrigued by the ads for Christian Drug Rehab and The Miracles of Jesus Planning Kit.
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Can't remember if I ever linked to it, but for those of you who don't check out the MetaFilter Music site, there have been many varied covers of the Cohen opus there (http://www.metafilter.com/contribute/search.mefi?q=hallelujah&site=music). (There's some other crap mixed in, due to imperfect searching.)