The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Trivial Pursuits => Arts & Entertainment => Topic started by: theinevitable on April 12, 2006, 02:05:54 am
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So, Pink Floyd's The Wall. Has it stood up to the test of time? are Pink Floyd just a bunch of stoned and pretentious assholes? do you do drugs and watch it?
did you do what I did, and assume that no one knew what it was about? I definitely came up to my friend who watched it with me a week later and said "ok, here's my theory--" only to be informed that no, apparently we know what it's about.
So. Does anyone else aspire to be able to play the guitar solo on Comfortably Numb? it is one of few pieces of music which has made me gasp with emotion.
also, I do not mean to have been a crap dude with the title. if it annoys or confuses anyone, I suppose I can change it.
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This board is decidedly split on Pink Floyd. I'm in the love 'em camp, but The Wall isn't my favorite of their albums. It's hard for me to get too into them these days because i've heard them so much over the years. If they were to dig a live recording out of the vaults like Zep did a couple of years it might rekindle my interest, but until then i'll let them continue to moulder. I've listened to Floyd under the influence, but I enjoy them sober as well. Fun fact, the female voice in the hotel suite when Pink throws a tantrum "wanna take a bath?" is Toni Tenille.
~Paul
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So, Pink Floyd's The Wall. Has it stood up to the test of time? are Pink Floyd just a bunch of stoned and pretentious assholes? do you do drugs and watch it?
did you do what I did, and assume that no one knew what it was about? I definitely came up to my friend who watched it with me a week later and said "ok, here's my theory--" only to be informed that no, apparently we know what it's about.
So. Does anyone else aspire to be able to play the guitar solo on Comfortably Numb? it is one of few pieces of music which has made me gasp with emotion.
also, I do not mean to have been a crap dude with the title. if it annoys or confuses anyone, I suppose I can change it.
If it wasn't for Pink Floyd, I wouldn't be alive today. Well, that's not true, but if it wasn't for them, my perspective on music and many other things wouldn't be nearly the same.
Yes, I have watched the movie on all kinds of drugs. Just try to understand something about it, it doesn't really matter what. Then, go back a few months later and watch it again, and you will get different things out of it. And then again. This basically happens with any good movie. And any good drugs. But don't do drugs.
To tell you the truth, the solo is not really that difficult to play. Once you start playing lead guitar and learn the pentatonic scale, you are probably ready to learn to play the solo. But learning someone else's solo only provides so much satisfaction. Gotta play your own. That being said, the first solo I learned note for note was Money. Also, I have the tab book for The Wall somewhere. Additionally, Comfortably Numb is probably transcribed in guitar mags like, at least once a month.
While I was typing, new replies were posted: Yeah, while The Wall is excellent, it is overshadowed by the brilliance of their other albums. I reccomend Wish You Were Here at max volume while chugging cough syrup.
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I've been listening to Piper a lot lately.
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Most mind-numbingly boring solo to ever be called the greatest solo of all time. I mean, fuck, it's in the song's title.
Meddle, though, that's a fanstastic record.
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Most mind-numbingly boring solo to ever be called the greatest solo of all time.
Now now Miles.
~Paul
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This is going to turn into a general Pink Floyd thread, and I am okay with that. "Money" is one of those songs with a bass line that I can feel in the pit of my stomach, and I love it; I turn the subwoofer up on my speakers and probably annoy the hell out of my housemates, but I don't care (for those of you who are curious, the others that do this for me are Radiohead's "The National Anthem" and Portishead's "Wandering Star." Oh God yes).
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wow. definitely did not mean to put this in History. Sorry paul.
hm. I own Meddle on vinyl. it was my dad's in college. I've never really listened to it.
yeah, I am a really really shitty guitar player. I know the pentatonic scale. I play for long periods every day. but I have no discipline, and no accuracy. my speed is for crap because of this.
the thing which is upsetting me right now: I just got my new guitar. I love it. it sounds like a dream. it felt better than any of the other guitars I tried out.
but my P.O.S. 130$ Ibanez still feels much better. It's light, it's tiny, the neck is thin, and it can have really thin strings because it doesn't have a tremolo. it sounds horrible. but I can play so much better on that guitar. what is the deal. I am wishing it wasn't an Act Worthy of Capital Punishment to try to get the ibanez neck put on the fender.
old guitar (http://myspace-725.vo.llnwd.net/00153/52/74/153394725_l.jpg)
new guitar (forgive me, but I like this picture, even if I am trying way too hard to be cool) (http://myspace-437.vo.llnwd.net/00581/73/44/581884437_l.jpg)
so, yes. What am I missing about playing guitar? the answer is probably "discipline". I'm working on that. I think another part of the problem, is that most of the bands I enjoy have very simplistic guitar parts. The ones which have more complicated guitar are difficult to find tablature for. It is difficult to learn a song by ear if I can't physically play it in the first place..
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Well, if you play for long periods each day and know the pentatonic scale, you're definitly on the right track.
Important question is, is do you know how to apply the scale? The only way to learn this is to play over music and the easiest way to go about that is to just play some music in the background and fuck around on the instrument. Listen carefully to the music and search for notes on the instrument that sound good and try to figure out which notes are good and which sound shitty, then play the good ones. This does not seem like very thorough advice, but it is really the best I can give. Hmmm, maybe try playing only one string, that is kind of how I started improvising. Like, for example, lets say you play along to Comfortably Numb, the song is in B minor. Try just playing the B string and use frets 0, 3, 5, 7, 10, 12, and just fuck around and try to play melodies or whatnot. This should work pretty well, because the open string will be the root note.
When that gets boring, make it the minor scale and on the B use 0, 2, 3, 5, 7, 8, 10, 12. It doesn't matter how fast or accurate you play at this point, you just need to try play things that complement the music, and you only need one note for that.
Improvising on one string should be pretty helpful with or without music in the background. Perhaps you would enjoy the spanish-gypsy scale (a mode of harmonic minor) which would look like 0, 1, 4, 5, 7, 8, 10, 12.
Just don't be afraid to play things that don't sound and eventually you will start finding things that sound good.
Speed and accuracy will come with time, there really is no fun way to go about it besides playing excercises. Playing chromatically up and down the strings like 12, 11, 10, 9, 12, 11, 10, 9, 12, 11, 10, 9 (using a different finger for each fret) and challenging yourself to just play as fast as possible, and then faster, will probably be the best way to improve on that.
So... good luck. Let me know if this works out at all. Also, I owe you a picture of my guitar.
And learning by ear, that takes a lot of experience.
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wow.
so, I definitely learned the spanish gypsy scale at some point. all I remember of it is this one cool sounding riff I wrote.
amazingly: the thing you said to do, with trying to improvise along with songs? i just started doing that a few days ago. Well, no, I had actually tried doing it along to Velvet Underground songs before, but at that time I was mostly being wierd. Now that I know that this isn't a totally rediculous way to learn guitar, I will continue.
I was, actually, finding that this was a good way to learn the scales all over the neck. I used a program to make a (crappy, skipping) loop of a I-IV-V in A, and just messed around until I'd figured out the scale in other positions. obviously I could have figured this out by knowing the notes of the scale. But no matter how many times I do something like chart out a scale on graph paper in math class (I mean... I would never do that!), the scales don't stick well in my head unless I figure them out in a more fluid way.
anyway. thank you.
edit: I'd like to say, in my defense, I am not that kid who has a nice guitar and can't play it. at least, I don't think so.my level of playing ability is most likely reasonable for my years of playing, age, etc. It's more an issue of frustration with being unable to play the things I want to play. we're not talking "theinevitable has a new fender guitar that his parents bought him, and he can't play "stairway to heaven" or "heartbreaker"".
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hm. I own Meddle on vinyl. it was my dad's in college. I've never really listened to it.
A. Go fuck*ng listen to Meddle now. Right now. I mean it godammit! Then rent Pink Floyd Live at Pompeii. Oh yeah, and you must listen to it LOUD.
B. Heh. I own Meddle on vinyl. That was my upgrade copy. My original was on 8-track.
Hobot, if you like the Money bass line, you must listen to Meddle too. At least "One of These Days."
I know that it's long been fashionable in certain quarters to sneer at Pink Floyd. I don't care. They're my favorite band and have been for almost 30 years now.
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I know that it's long been fashionable in certain quarters to sneer at Pink Floyd.
What possible reason could one have to sneer at Mr. Floyd (http://www.utahbirds.org/featarts/2004/UtahsPinkFloyd.htm)?
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Hobot, if you like the Money bass line, you must listen to Meddle too. At least "One of These Days."
Will do!
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Will do!
Please promise me that you'll turn it up to 11.
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Please promise me that you'll turn it up to 11.
Tomorrow afternoon, when everyone in the house isn't sleeping (college students need all the sleep they can get, after all), I will listen to Meddle at a very high volume, just for you.
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edit: I'd like to say, in my defense, I am not that kid who has a nice guitar and can't play it. at least, I don't think so.my level of playing ability is most likely reasonable for my years of playing, age, etc. It's more an issue of frustration with being unable to play the things I want to play. we're not talking "theinevitable has a new fender guitar that his parents bought him, and he can't play "stairway to heaven" or "heartbreaker"".
Nah, that's not what I'm getting at, I've just seen alot of people get frustrated and go nowhere because they just don't have the right approach. But you're definetly doing the right things at this point. This one buddy of mine (before I could really play) he used to put in so much effort and he just always sucked. Man... he sucked so bad forever.
Anyway, this (http://img55.imageshack.us/img55/8845/sarch9ef.jpg) is the only guitar I play anymore, besides some busted jazz bass. It may be interesting to note that there is a lottery ticket in picture.
When it is your first time listening to Meddle, you've gotta be hella serious about it. It's not something you would want to be distracted from, and if you have been saving some sort of hallucinogen for a special occasion then you should consume it 5 - 40 minutes beforehand, depending on route of administration. If that's your thing.
That album takes some sharp turns, but as long as you are in the right mindset when listening, it won't be hard to see how graceful the twists are.
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As my Dad always tells me: If you have nothing nice to say about Pink Floyd, don't say anything at all. Except that short qualifying statement to the left.
EDIT: Another Brick In The Wall has one fuck*ng weird video, and some of the album covers hurt my brain a little, so it's not all bad. IN MY OPINION.
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I haven't really listened to the wall since high school. I'm afraid it might fall into that category of "Music I thought was really deep when I was younger, but sounds really whiny now". You guys have given me hope that I'll still like it.
We got to watch a bit of the movie in my high school western civ class, actually. We did a lot of film analysis, and we got to examine the hell out of the non-naughty bits. Then my friends and I rented it, got stoned out of our gourds and watched it and A Clockwork Orange. Had some weird dreams that night, let me tell ya.
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yeah, I didn't think that was what you were getting at, *****_god... I was just paranoid, because I realized that that was what I was coming across as.
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When it is your first time listening to Meddle, you've gotta be hella serious about it. It's not something you would want to be distracted from, and if you have been saving some sort of hallucinogen for a special occasion then you should consume it 5 - 40 minutes beforehand, depending on route of administration. If that's your thing.
That album takes some sharp turns, but as long as you are in the right mindset when listening, it won't be hard to see how graceful the twists are.
Yeah, that's not my thing, but I'll definitely pay attention when listening to it. Thanks for the heads-up (especially because I usually forget to take notice of music I'm listening to, particularly if it is new).
I haven't really listened to the wall since high school. I'm afraid it might fall into that category of "Music I thought was really deep when I was younger, but sounds really whiny now". You guys have given me hope that I'll still like it.
We got to watch a bit of the movie in my high school western civ class, actually. We did a lot of film analysis, and we got to examine the hell out of the non-naughty bits. Then my friends and I rented it, got stoned out of our gourds and watched it and A Clockwork Orange. Had some weird dreams that night, let me tell ya.
I can't imagine Pink Floyd ever being considered whiny. Depressing, occasionally; complex, usually; and mind-bending (with or without the assistance of toxic substances), always -- but never whiny. Give it another try!
Also, a big "Hell yes" to any and all Stanley Kubrick films.
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I can't imagine Pink Floyd ever being considered whiny. Depressing, occasionally; complex, usually; and mind-bending (with or without the assistance of toxic substances), always -- but never whiny.
Sometimes Roger's "ain't it tough to be a rock star" thing got a bit tiresome, but I can still listen to Floyd pretty much whenever. I just noticed about a month ago that I can't find my copy of Dark Side of the Moon, so I think that sometime soon I'll need to buy my fourth copy of that album.
Meddle is seconded, and I also think that Obscured By Clouds doesn't get the love it deserves.
Also, I'm not sure if it's intentional, but the second to last track on the new Flaming Lips album really reminds me of "One Of These Days" from Meddle.
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Lots of love for Meddle, i'll jump on that bandwagon. Like I say it's hard for me to really judge Floyd because i'm so burned out on them. Meddle stands up for me because it hasn't been burned to a crisp like everything they've done since. These kids are hearing Floyd like I heard it 25-30 years ago. I can remember how much I loved Money, Shine On You Crazy Diamond, the entire Animals album. I haven't heard it in a while, might have to try and see if I can rekindle that spark. Nah, i've got 4 new BPB albums and 2 new Kinks albums. I know that the Kinks have been around even longer than Floyd, but I never listened to them enough to get burned out on them. Maybe the radio hits, but they have a deep catalog and it's all great. Oh yeah and the Faces, how did I overlook this band for so long? They're like almost the greatest band ever. Ever!!!
~Paul
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I have no feelings either way about Pink Floyd in general, but as to the original question, as to whether The Wall stands up to today, here is my answer:
Yes.
I saw The Wall for the first time ever somewhere between 2 to 1 1/2 years ago, on the crystal clear special ed. DVD, and as I watched it, I was really impressed and I kept questioning how it could possibly be from 1982 - at least design-wise, it doesn't have and 80's look to it.
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Nah, i've got 4 new BPB albums and 2 new Kinks albums. I know that the Kinks have been around even longer than Floyd, but I never listened to them enough to get burned out on them. Maybe the radio hits, but they have a deep catalog and it's all great. Oh yeah and the Faces, how did I overlook this band for so long? They're like almost the greatest band ever. Ever!!!
~Paul
I've just delved into the Kinks recently too. Wow, that Ray Davies is a hell of a songwriter. The Village Green Preservation Society is a great album. Maybe I'll check out the Faces next.
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Nah, i've got 4 new BPB
Not that that he has anything to tour behind, but man I hope he adds some dates to his current tour. I've seen him twice solo and twice as BPB with full band. Solo the first time was great and the second time was OK, but he was opening for Bjork at the Hollywood Bowl, so, you know. But with full band backing him, he's fuck*ng fantastic. I saw him this past August in Hamburg, and I still get chills thinking about it. Part of it was seeing him in Hamburg, but no matter where you see him, he fuck*ng rocks. The night was straight-up magical.
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Part of it was seeing him in Hamburg... The night was straight-up magical.
What about Hamburg is magical? Do you think German guys are like, "Part of it was seeing him in Cleveland..." Maybe so.
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Admittedly it has much to do with my obsession with Germany. But really, do you think Cleveland is Hamburg's American counterpart?
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Admittedly it has much to do with my obsession with Germany. But really, do you think Cleveland is Hamburg's American counterpart?
Maybe, from a rock and roll standpoint. Hamburg has that whole Beatles history, Cleveland has the RnR Hall of fame and is renowned as a rockin' town. I don't know what i'm talking about.
~Paul
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Admittedly it has much to do with my obsession with Germany. But really, do you think Cleveland is Hamburg's American counterpart?
I'd think more like Portland OR.
And the guys who hang around the Hamburg train station? Definitely magical.
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I've just delved into the Kinks recently too. Wow, that Ray Davies is a hell of a songwriter. The Village Green Preservation Society is a great album. Maybe I'll check out the Faces next.
The Small Faces? I read so much stuff about them and loved Here Comes the Nice, then downloaded on of their albums and the only decent song was Ichycoo Park. Oh well, the Kinks are tits.
WEIRDEST THING EVER:
Somehow, someway I came across theinevitable's blog or my space or some shit. This was like a month or two ago, before I was here, and saw his guitar. That is like my favorite guitar ever, and I was going to write you a message and tell you, but how weird would that have been. You also like Sonic Youth so I was going to end you a message because of that as well. Anyways, if my band ever takes off I am buying a guitar just like yours (I play bass btw, which is why I have to wait. I just bought a 500 bass amp and am looking to get a harder hitting bass this summer).
Edit: Oh yeah, the post. I hate Pink Floyd, unless we be talking Piper at the Gates of Dawn. Love barrett, hate floyd.
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wow, yeah. I love this guitar so much. I actually posted here asking advice on whether to buy it. Everyone said not to, but... whatever. i love it.
and yes, it is really wierd that you saw it before.
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The Small Faces? I read so much stuff about them and loved Here Comes the Nice, then downloaded on of their albums and the only decent song was Ichycoo Park.
The Faces and the Small Faces are not the same band. The Faces was born from the ashes of the Small Faces, with the drummer and bassist carrying over to the new band. The Who and The Guess Who are different bands as well, btw.
Oh well, the Kinks are tits.
Is this a good thing or a bad thing?
~Paul
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The Faces and the Small Faces are not the same band. The Faces was born from the ashes of the Small Faces, with the drummer and bassist carrying over to the new band. The Who and The Guess Who are different bands as well, btw.
Is this a good thing or a bad thing?
~Paul
Good.
Did you notice how I asked? I guess I could have looked it up. They did seem to have a pretty tight rhythm section, maybe I will look in to them.
Thanks for the Who info, btw. Did you know that Kravitz "American Woman" song was a Guess Who cover? (sarcasm)
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Has it stood up to the test of time?
Yes. Pretty much the last rock opera/concept album that was worth half an arse, which puts it in very rare company indeed.
are Pink Floyd just a bunch of stoned and pretentious assholes?
Yes. They were also shtonkin' great musicians in their time. Their reputation for wankery is not undeserved, but such splendid wankery it was.
do you do drugs and watch it?
I saw the movie when it was first released. I got so wasted I passed out before we even got into the theater and I still hated every minute of it. Some movies are better left in the mind.
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I am pretty much the only person who thinks that "The Final Cut" is the best Pink Floyd album ever but, as I think I've mentioned, I'm a really big fan of albums that are about ground-level meditations on the end of the world.
The Wall, well, I'd say there are parts of it that are very good and parts that are just meh.
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I can never decide if The Final Cut is a brilliant album or just a load of LiveJournal-grade puling and moaning courtesy of Mr. Waters. That, and it's not really a Pink Floyd album in anything other than name. Plus, it's so SLOW. That said, there are those rare times when it scratches an itch for me that no other album can (and it does really demand a front-to-back listen for best effect). I guess I should get me another copy one of these days.
The Wall is chock-full of tracks which one might consider somewhat... minor, I suppose, but that is part and parcel of the whole conceit of a concept album. I'm glad no one bothers with that crap anymore.
That said, I've always been an Animals man myself. That shit be fresh.