The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Trivial Pursuits => History => Topic started by: jay-ell on August 29, 2008, 04:52:42 pm
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pedro_picasso: Sen. John McCain has chosen Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin to be his vice presidential candidate on the Republican ticket for the White House, the campaign said Friday.
pedro_picasso: Just thought you might want to know.
jldunston: neat! A lady!
jldunston: Probably not a coincidence.
pedro_picasso: I know, right? You're a lady. She's a lady. It's totally connected.
jldunston: Heh
pedro_picasso: ;)
jldunston: What are the odds, right?
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Alaska and Arizona?
Who the hell wants people from fly over country in the big office.
Where are you going that requires flying over Alaska?
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Where are you going that requires flying over Alaska?
Is it Russia? I bet it's Russia.
Commie.
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Interesting choice, considering one of McCain's primary slams on Obama is his lack of experience. So let's take a first-term governor from a sparsely populated state, whose prior gig was mayor of a town of 8,000, and put her a heartbeat from the presidency, behind a would-be president of advanced age.
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Obama's lack of experience is addressed by McCain's experience. See how that works? Does McCain look dead to you? My theory is that he is intending to not run for re-election in 2012. That would allow for Sarah Palin to be a historical figure twice, and would drive the stake through Hilary's heart although I doubt that would even finish her off.
What I want to know is how is the 'candidate of change' picking an old white guy whose been in the Senate forever? Where's the change? All of the change is on the other side: a Senator well known to be a Maverick and a running mate well known for running on reform, fairness and anti-corruption (not to mention campaigning on the Environment AND drilling in ANWR at the same time). McCain has made a very out-of-the-box running mate choice that underscores and emphasizes that it is not going to be business as usual in Washington. The presence of Joe Biden doesn't inspire that on the other side.
McCain picked a well spoken, dynamic female running mate with more executive experience than either of the Democrats; a solid union member with a solid union member husband, both NRA members; obvious chops on education, motherhood, special needs, and having serious potential appeal to the women the Democrats left behind when they threw Hillary under the bus.
So, it should be an interesting 67 days.
How come no one yelled at Al Gore for comparing Obama to Lincoln? Is My American Cousin playing in Washington in the next few years?
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I have neither the time nor energy nor desire to get into a point by point, but one bit I can't let slide.
a Senator well known to be a Maverick
HA. Hasn't been appropriate for quite some time. Voted with Bush policies 90% of the time, remember? Define his mavericky-ness, other than just because that's what everyone calls him.
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So let's take a first-term governor from a sparsely populated state, whose prior gig was mayor of a town of 8,000
Well, I guess it's about time that people started getting jobs just because they DON'T have a c*ck, for a change.
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Well, I guess it's about time that people started getting jobs just because they DON'T have a c*ck, for a change.
I fully support this policy, especially as it relates to hookers and strippers.
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Should I just go back to fuck*ng esperanto now?
I don't know, was she hired in compliance with Wombat's policy?
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Here, this saves me a lot of typing. (http://www.metafilter.com/74487/Sarah-Palin-as-McCains-runningmate#2235972)
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Oh god, let's just not talk about politics. I have had enough. Now we know who's running, can't we just skip all the in between and have the damn election tomorrow?
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My sentiments exactly.
I'm not going to change your mind and you aren't going to change mine. What's the point?
How many truly undecided voters do you think are out there?
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I'm not going to change your mind and you aren't going to change mine. What's the point?
What the Egg Man said.
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I mean it's all a letdown after finding out it wasn't Michael Palin anyways...
Now that would be a much harder ticket for me to vote against.
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My Vice-Presidential candidate is rubber, your Presidential candidate is glue. Everything you say bounces off her and sticks to ... um your guy.
(S)He's inexperienced.
(S)He's from a weird part of the country.
(S)He's a celebrity.
(S)He's someone who generally tows the party line.
What we mean to say is that Barak Obama would probably also make a good Vice-Presidential candidate. Now, let's get back to the adult's table, and do some business.
This message was brought to you by John McCain for President and the Allies Against Big Glue.
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Well, I guess it's about time that people started getting jobs just because they DON'T have a c*ck, for a change.
QFMFT.
Also, somebody needs to point out that the previous two presidents were former governors, not former senators. Nobody made a Thing of it then, IIRC.
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QFMFT.
Also, somebody needs to point out that the previous two presidents were former governors, not former senators. Nobody made a Thing of it then, IIRC.
Well, yeah, isn't that the point of executive experience vs legislative experience.
Also, Ms Palin killed the Bridge to Nowhere project as governor of Alaska. That was a 300 million dollar bridge between Ketchikan (pop 8,000) and an airport on another island (pop 50). For some ungodly reason Federal funding for this project actually passed Congress.
Senator Obama voted for the bridge appropriation bill. Governor Palin said, quote "If Alaska needs a bridge, we'll build it ourselves".
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That was a 300 million dollar bridge between Ketchikan (pop 8,000) and an airport on another island (pop 50).
The problem here is that ferries are too unreliable. They're sort of, catch-as-Ketchican.
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Just as an aside I found interesting-
Palin holds a bachelor's degree in journalism from the University of Idaho. (2 years executive experience)
John McCain graduated from Annapolis ranked 894 out of 899 in his class. (25 years legislative experience)
- 27 years combined experience
Joe Biden double-majored in History and Political Science from U of Deleware. Then received his Juris Doctorate from Syracuse U College of Law. (25 years legislative experience)
Barack Obama studied Political Science and International Relations at Columbia. Then received his Juris Doctorate magna cum laude from Harvard. (10 years legislative experience)
- 35 years combined experience
While not the only criteria anyone would use to decide their vote, one team is clearly better educated and more experienced than the other. One team might have an easier time convincing me to trust them with the most important and complicated job in the country.
Considering the Vice President basically waits for the President to die so that he/she can then become president - I have a hard time convincing myself that the small-town mayor, one year governor of Alaska with a BA in Journalism is going to be able to jump in and run the country after the untimely death of a president.
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Come on, you can't deny that time means something. Yes, sitting on your butt for 25 years means nothing. But assuming that people are not just sitting on their butts, 2 years of doing something is just not as good as 25 years of doing it. It's 23 more years worth of chances to learn stuff, test ideas, see how things work, react to different situations. It matters.
I'm actually kind of flabbergasted by this choice. Given the age issue and the need for a VP that was clearly qualified to be president, anyone could have predicted that the charge of lack of experience would be made. It is beside the point whether you think those attacks are legitimate - the point is, it was inevitable that they'd happen. What where they thinking? Why leave yourself so wide open to that criticism? It just doesn't make sense. It's not like she's the only woman Republican they could have picked.
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Cynically, it may depend on whether you want the white guy who has run for nomination and been squashed multiple times or the energetic lady who may well be a true Washington outsider in the White House.
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Just going back to something A-Dawg said on the front page: How is Obama picking an old guard character a bad thing but McCain picking the (relatively) untried young gun a good thing? Seems like more or less the same thing. It sounds like they are both trying to pick someone that compliments their own abilities/personality.
I'll reiterate what I said ages ago in the Hillary/Obama thread: With McCain vs. Obama I think either way you guys are alright, my personal politics makes me prefer Obama but they both seem like relatively sane guys.
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Well, a HUGE difference is that McCain is 72 and has had cancer twice. So that means he will have to live to 76 to avoid having a person who no one has ever heard of and who until two years ago was mayor of a town with less than 9,000 people becoming president.
Also, Biden isn't off his fuck*ng rocker.
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Today I went on a (double date?) outing where the president of the college democrats was present, and he was a mega-dick. I almost got in a big argument with him in the middle of a pleasant walk in the Botanical Gardens.
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I'm just going to get this out there, and sorry if I offend any of you good people but:
People involved in student politics == dicks.
And loud annoying opinionated dicks at that.
If any of you were involved in student politics then I am glad to see you grew out of it and became fully functioning members of society.
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see, it wasn't even that. It was just that he did that thing where...
"I work at KWUR, I'm the music director"
"oh, man, the people at KWUR are douches"
"um... I work at KWUR, I'm the music director."
"god, everyone at KWUR can't do anything, they're so lazy, they're idiots."
"Um. I work at KWUR. I'm the music director."
&c.
also my friend asked about Palin, and he didn't answer. So then I started answering, and he felt the need to correct every dang fact I brought out. But never got to the point where he started contributing other than
"she's been the governer for like a year"
"no, 18 months."
"she was like, Ms Alaska..."
"No, she was the runner-up."
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Doc is correct. A-cap's contribution is interesting.
In other vp observations: Doesn't Biden have a weird forehead?
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Growing up, my dad taught me that when it came time to choose a VP, you should always "balance the ticket." That's why Kennedy chose Johnson -- he needed a southerner on the ticket. They certainly were not buddies or anything. And Johnson was unusual in that he was a southerner with a pro-Civil Rights stance.
I think McCain wanted a woman. I think she had to be everything Hilary was not. From what little I've seen of her, she has a blue-collar, get-your-hands-dirty feeling. She's the anti-Hilary, meant to draw in those women who said, as I did, "I'd love to see a woman president, as long as it's not her."
I also think that voting for someone (or not) based on his VP pick and assuming he's going to die in office is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
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I also think that voting for someone (or not) based on his VP pick and assuming he's going to die in office is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
But in this election it's all anybody can talk about.
McCain is old and has cancer several times. IIRC, even Bonzo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Brain_Is_Hanging_Upside_Down_(Bonzo_Goes_to_Bitburg)) was younger when he first took office. It might be nothing to worry about, Cheney last 8 years, but given the stress of the job and how much common knowledge says it ages a person it's definitely something to at least consider.
Since Obama starting running I can't count the number of people who have said they just assume there will be attempts at assassination because he's black. To me and the people I know that's a non-issue but supposedly there are still people in this country who froth at the mouth at the thought of a black president. Are there? I have no idea. Maybe people just watch too much 24.
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see, it wasn't even that. It was just that he did that thing where...
"I work at KWUR, I'm the music director"
"oh, man, the people at KWUR are douches"
"um... I work at KWUR, I'm the music director."
"god, everyone at KWUR can't do anything, they're so lazy, they're idiots."
"Um. I work at KWUR. I'm the music director."
&c.
That's just being an unmitigated asshole. You would have been perfectly justified if you'd punched him in the throat.
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yeah. Instead I said something eventually like "Um, I'm not going to argue with you about this right now." and then a cute little kid walked up and started talking to us so we just spent some time thinking the kid was adorable.
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Found on a forum somewhere:
"The only thing more retarded than McCain's policies is Palin's son."
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I'm waiting to buy whatever Palin-themed apparel tshirthell.com is planning. Cafepress is already chock full of the inevitable "VPILF" t-shirts, but I expect better from the Zen Masters of Tasteless.
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In other news, Sarah Palin pretended to have a baby in order to cover her teenage daughter's pregnancy. http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/30/121350/137 (http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/30/121350/137)
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HA!
Is it vindictive of me to hope beyond hope that that story checks out? Not so much because of the family turmoil, etc. etc., but because the evangelicals have such an (unholy) hard-on for her?
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HA!
Is it vindictive of me to hope beyond hope that that story checks out? Not so much because of the family turmoil, etc. etc., but because the evangelicals have such an (unholy) hard-on for her?
Not vindictive, just human. Who can resist the satisfaction of seeing the holier-than-thou fall on their faces?
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Im just
not sure how I feel about the potential president of the united states pulling off elaborate lies.
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Im just not sure how I feel about the potential president of the united states pulling off elaborate lies.
That sounds like the primary job requirement.
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Cort may have a point there.
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Yeah, I mean, administrations have been lying for the last
8 16 20 211 years (I hold out hope that Washington's administration was on the up-and-up).
This seems like it could turn into another case of "It's not the crime, it's the cover-up." The Republicans said that they weren't going after Bill Clinton for doinking the chubby girl, it was that he lied about it (even if the truth was that they wanted to drag him through the mud). If Palin said, "My daughter's pregnant, and our family has decided that my husband and I will raise the child," the evangelicals would get huffy, but the rest of the country wouldn't bat an eye. In an election where both parties are trying hard to convince us that they're Just Like Us, that should be something that can be spun into a positive - what's more Typically American these days than teenagers getting knocked up?
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This seems like it could turn into another case of "It's not the crime, it's the cover-up."
Absolutely. I don't get it, how politicians continue not to realize this. But I guess if you're egotistical enough to be a politician, you're egotistical enough to believe that you are different, you are the one who won't get caught.
And what's so foolish about this one is that there's ONLY a coverup - there never was a crime. Unless, of course, you believe that out of wedlock pregnancy is criminal.
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Well, yeah, isn't that the point of executive experience vs legislative experience.
Also, Ms Palin killed the Bridge to Nowhere project as governor of Alaska. That was a 300 million dollar bridge between Ketchikan (pop 8,000) and an airport on another island (pop 50). For some ungodly reason Federal funding for this project actually passed Congress.
Senator Obama voted for the bridge appropriation bill. Governor Palin said, quote "If Alaska needs a bridge, we'll build it ourselves".
I don't really know anything about this but I thought this might interest you. (http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/08/29/did-palin-really-fight-the-bridge-to-nowhere.aspx)
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And what's so foolish about this one is that there's ONLY a coverup - there never was a crime. Unless, of course, you believe that out of wedlock pregnancy is criminal.
Many of her supporters probably feel it should be that way.
And I guess the fear would be that the Democrats would say, "Well, how can she be trusted to run the country, when she can't even run her family right?" But let's be serious here - the Democrats are too pussy to do that. That kind of viciousness isn't in the Democrat's DNA... only Republicans can pull that shit off.
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Oh, you know.
They'll figure out a way to spin it in a fashion where it makes her even MORE the exemplar of the anti-abortion movement.
Shit, they'll make it a PLUS with the real fuck*ng psychotic devotees to legally defining women as incubational chambers first and citizens second.
Remember, she's not on the ticket so much because she's a batshit religious extremist in general... but because of her appeal to one-issue anti-women's-rights voters that just happens to flow OUT of her batshit insanity.
They needed a woman to take one last grasp at the Hilnuts, they needed to shore up the anti-choice vote and they needed someone with what sounded like a prestigious office.
They'll spin, The Bastards will spin.
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LFM, I'm cutting you off. No more frothy bile for you. I'm tired of trying to get the stains out of the carpet.
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That's all right, LFM, I'll sneak you some... I'm an enabler like that.
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C'mon JL. Just writing the way he does makes a case for going the opposite of all that bile stuff.
And lord knows there are no bulging eyed, throbbing veined, flop sweating, looney-eyed raving maniacs out there advocating on behalf of the right wing. So vote with your genitals instead of your intellect.
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i had a dream last night that McCain changed his running mate to another random lady I had never heard of.
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In other news, Sarah Palin pretended to have a baby in order to cover her teenage daughter's pregnancy. http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/30/121350/137 (http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/30/121350/137)
Turns out that whole argument is pretty much moot now:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080901/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_palin_daughter (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080901/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_palin_daughter)
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I hardly think they aren't all gits, but I needed our resident one for an example.
But hey, thanks for taking an in house example and expanding it to throw some turds at me, councilor. It seems this season brings out the best in all of us.
I think he was saying that there are bile volcanoes on both sides. No turds were thrown.
Turd is possibly my least favorite word. EWW.
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Turns out that whole argument is pretty much moot now:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080901/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_palin_daughter (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080901/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_palin_daughter)
Yeah, this was not the way I predicted the rebuttal to come out. "No, my 17 year old daughter couldn't have given birth in April, because she's 5 months pregnant now!" Ohhh shiiiittt.
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So now we can get back to the real question which is what the hell kind of a name is Bristol?
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Yeah, pretty much.
I have to say that I wasn't convinced by the web site I saw. I have known women who showed less on subsequent pregnancies than they did on their earlier ones. And fit women, especially runners, often don't "show" until much, much later. I knew a woman who was a competitive ballroom dancer (I worked for her husband) and she competed until just a couple of weeks before she gave birth. She never wore maternity clothes, either. It's enough to make you sick, practically, but it happens.
@ wombat: Bristol is a perfectly good name. It's every bit as good as Moxie CrimeFighter.
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I hardly think they aren't all gits, but I needed our resident one for an example.
But hey, thanks for taking an in house example and expanding it to throw some turds at me, councilor. It seems this season brings out the best in all of us.
Those turds weren't thrown at you.
Also -- pet peeve: councilor = one who is a member of a council, e.g. a city councilor. Counselor = one who provide counsel, e.g. an attorney.
That pedantic turd was thrown at you.
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Turd blossom!
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Haha. "On a very special episode... of Turd Blossom."
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The Awesome Turd Blossom is my favorite thing to eat at Outback Steakhouse.
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My great-grandma used to make those at the Shithouse Out Back...
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Well, not as awesome as the backroom discussion where McCain has to go all "Chinatown" to clear up the various parentages so that they got their stories straight.
"He's my son!"
"He's my grandson!"
"He's my son!"
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"Our governor is going to be vice president, and we still don't have an Olive Garden.''
--Alaskan Kerry Baranou, bemoaning the local dining choices while celebrating the prospect of Sarah Palin going to the White House, in Sunday's New York Times.
That is awesome
There would seem to be an opportunity here for Obama to pick up some votes. "Abortions for some, Olive Gardens for others."
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http://ccinsider.comedycentral.com/cc_insider/2008/09/jon-stewart-ann.html (http://ccinsider.comedycentral.com/cc_insider/2008/09/jon-stewart-ann.html)
This was absolutely hilarious. I especially liked the part where O'Reilly says that 16 year old spears' pregnancy should be blamed on poor parenting, then completely OKs teen pregnancy when it comes to Governor Palin.
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I'm not ashamed to admit it - I get 20% of my news from the Yahoo! front page, 35% from Countdown with Keith Olbermann, and 45% from The Daily Show.
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I get 50% of my news from NPR, 25% from Air America, 20% from assorted newspapers and 5% from Conspiracy Monster, a muppet that lives inside my head.
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If there were a Muppets news program on the air, I'd watch it. Come to think of it, I'd watch Muppets do just about anything.
Porn. I would not watch Muppets porn. I draw the line there.
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If there were a Muppets news program on the air, I'd watch it. Come to think of it, I'd watch Muppets do just about anything.
Porn. I would not watch Muppets porn. I draw the line there.
I believe there was a segment on the old Daily Show about just this genre.
Muppet Mythbusters would punish.
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Haven't you guys ever heard of GNN (http://www.sesamestreet.org/video_player?p_p_lifecycle=0&p_p_id=videoPlayer_WAR_sesameportlets4369&p_p_uid=86730c18-154b-11dd-8ea8-a3d2ac25b65b)?
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Haven't you guys ever heard of GNN (http://www.sesamestreet.org/video_player?p_p_lifecycle=0&p_p_id=videoPlayer_WAR_sesameportlets4369&p_p_uid=86730c18-154b-11dd-8ea8-a3d2ac25b65b)?
hahahah. "some grouches think the letter G is grouchy word because it starts words like "goo" "garbage"... and "gastroenteritis"
Tomorrow well go over basic shapes, like Circle, Square, and dodecadodecahedron.
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Haven't you guys ever heard of GNN (http://www.sesamestreet.org/video_player?p_p_lifecycle=0&p_p_id=videoPlayer_WAR_sesameportlets4369&p_p_uid=86730c18-154b-11dd-8ea8-a3d2ac25b65b)?
You do realize that I was afraid to click on that?
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News flash: Bobby has scarred Wombles.
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You do realize that I was afraid to click on that?
Wombles, would I ever lead you astray?
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John McCain gave a speech. When he was talking about tax policy, war, and domestic programs, I was very uncomfortable. When he was talking about being a POW and fighting to win in November, I was with him all the way. That leads me to believe that I am an idiot.
Also: Every time the crowd interrupted the speech to chant "USA, USA, USA" I was sure that all of Republicandom was piss-drunk. It turns out they had planned the chant to shout down protesters. I'd love to see video of protesters getting beaten and tear-gassed to the sound of the delegates chanting "USA USA!". That would be a great.
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News flash: Bobby has scarred Wombles.
Wasn't me.
I'd recommend Meet the Feebles.
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I'd recommend Meet the Feebles.
I'd vote for this man.
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Wasn't me.
That one wasn't you, no. You're just the one who's scarred me for life.
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I like where that gal is coming from. (http://ushuntingtoday.com/palinletter.pdf)
Kinda knocks the shine off of the intellectual or experience lightweight claims to me.
Absolutely. I'm sure that the bureaucrat who wrote that letter is experienced and is no intellectual lightweight.
Yours,
AW
Experienced and intellectual bureaucrat
Letter Ghostwriter
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I didn't want to be the one to say it.
________________
I'm jay-ell, and I approved this message.
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My take on it, based on the letter itself, is that it represents a long-standing policy in place for many years which therefore predates Mrs. Palin's administration. While she doesn't mention when the program began, the letter does refer to the history of the program which would indicate that it had begun more than 18 months ago.
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So why do the Republicans hate community organizers so much? Fuck anyone trying to make a difference where they live. Losers.
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I for one would like to see the Democrats jump on the "community organizer" thing like McCain's folks throw a fit any time someone says his POW status doesn't in and of itself qualify him to be President. (See "Clark, Wesley," who they managed to get booted from Obama's campaign despite the fact that he said something that's 100% true.)
They won't, though, because they suck at that kind of thing. To their peril.
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In what ways does that invalidate the current application? Are you saying it's just by rote copy cat-ism? It was generated in reaction to current legislation. I would think being able to react to current issues within the framework of established policies in an effectual and clear manner is indicative.
I'm not. I'm just saying this is probably not a program she instituted. Since you were offering it as a reason for supporting her, I was simply suggesting that this sort of thing was around long before she was. But hey, if this is what validates your political beliefs, knock yourself out. I'm probably just more cynical about state governments than you are -- my guess would be that if she'd thought about this particular issue for more than 15 minutes before she signed this letter I'd be impressed. And I don't mean that as a knock on her -- more as a comment on the relationship between bureaucrats and politicians in regards to obscure technical issues.
I guess all I'm saying is that this letter indicates more to me about the Alaska Department of giraffe and Wildlife than it does about Sarah Palin, for good or bad.
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I'd recommend Meet the Feebles.
I wouldn't. It's neither a particularly good movie nor a particularly accurate parody - it coasts entirely on "how gross a thing can we have knockoff Muppets do".
Contrast Avenue Q, which quite accurately parodies the style, format and tone of Sesame Street and Electric Company (among a few others) while inserting offensive (to some) content.