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[jough]

Okay, so I'm looking at buying a new MP3 player because I do not like the one that I have (I would never have thought that the lack of an "on-the-go" playlist for a 1.5Gb player would have been a problem, but yes, it is very very difficult to queue up songs on my Rio Nitrus, so much so that I hardly ever use it).

Anyway, I've been looking at all the super-nifty windows-based players, but then something in my head said "Hey, there's a new iPod - maybe it's a viable contender."  So I read up on it a bit and while the iPods aren't exactly feature-rich at least they sound good, do everything I want (i.e. PLAY MUSIC), and are so common that there's just a HUGE base of after-market gadgets and 3rd party mods to play with.  Plus, the thing is just USEABLE.

But I've never seen one outside of the 1st generation, which was lacking when compared to other HD-based players of the time.  So I'm wondering if anyone has a recent (3 or 4G) iPod and what their thoughts were on it.  There's like 5 million of the things out there so I figure on a geek-based forum surely someone would own one.

I can also get a deal from a wholesaler for a new 4g 40Gb iPod from HP (with all the Windows-centric software) for $250 new, and that includes a 2-year warranty which includes accidental damage (i.e. I could spill coffee on it and they'd replace it).  So I'm kinda thinking that's the way I'm going to go unless people who have owned them warn me against it.

I read the iPodLounge.com forum, but those people are *religious* and I am looking for a more partial view, especially from someone who both uses Windows and the iPod on it.

[CortJstr]

I've had a 40GB 3G since June. I think it works really well, I'm very happy with it. I have only 4 real complaints and 3 of those were fixed with the release of the 4G. (Battery replacement is the 1 that isn't)

Pros
* Big. For most everybody a 20/40 GB will hold ever song you own even the shit you never listen to like TV show theme songs.

* Super-intuitive user interface. Especially now that they put "shuffle" on the main menu

* Silent HD. Unless you hold it right next to your ear, that is.

* Quick charge. It takes 3-4 hours for a full charge but after 1 hour it's 80% full, the rest is trickle.

* Easy synching, especially if you keep everything on there all the time.

* Regular and smart playlists are quick & easy if you use iTunes.

* Long car rides are much easier to deal with.

* It gets really fuck*ng loud. Steve Jobs is partially deaf so the max volume is considerably louder than other players.

Cons
* Battery life. Although I hear the 4G is closer to 12 hours.

* Can't replace the battery yourself by design. ipodlounge has a guide but it's still not user friendly.

* You pretty much have to switch to iTunes

* Highly scratchable screen as it's flush with the body. I highly recommend you get a case with screen protector from somebody like ISkin.com

* If you're anal: the silver back is always streaked and fingerprinted.

* Many accesories are iPod specific. Because they attach to the proprietary connector on the bottom of the unit.

* Ear buds suck. Use other headphones. Plus the white cord looks pretentious unless you're at Whole Foods, in which case everybody has one.

* No OggVorbis support. There may be a hack for this though.

That said I frickin' love mine. I was trying harder to come up with cons because of your phrasing. Any other questions?

[jough]

It basically looks like a great product.  I got to play with one at Best Buy tonight - not that they have any on display at the store, but the guy working there said he had his new 4g 40Gb in the back room and he brought it out with a USB2 cable, installed iTunes on one of the floor models, and let me play with it for about a half an hour while we talked mp3.

Most of the cons you mentioned were things I've noticed or seen posted elsewhere (although I didn't consider that it didn't support Ogg - but I don't have any Ogg files anyway).

The accessories that only work with the iPod are no problem - that's pretty much true for any mp3 player or any electronic device.  Hopefully they'll keep the universal dock connector the same for a few generations.

You don't really have to use iTunes ever.  There's SO MUCH software available for the thing - I've already been playing with some of it even sans iPod.

Replacing the battery looks pretty simple.  There's a company that sells the replacements for $40.  No big deal.  I expect that it'll hold most of its charge for 18-24 months anyway, and by that time it'll be time to buy a new mp3 player.

I do plan on getting a case for it at the same time I order it and will pretty much always leave it in the dock or the case (I'm looking for a case that I can slip it into and out of - there are some great ones for the 3G but only a handful for the 4G - so I'll probably get something crappy and sleeve-like at first and then move to something form-fitting with cutouts for the screen and click wheel (I will also be dismantleing mine immediately - warranty be damned - to remove the stupid click sound from the click wheel - does it REALLY have to make make both an electronic noise (from the built-in speaker) AND a physical noise?).

In any case, there seems no downside to getting the HP version (commonly called the hPod now) as HP's support is better and they give you more windows-centric software and instructions.

I'm pretty much decided about getting it now - I just wanted to check to see if someone here had a BAD EXPERIENCE with them that the Apple-zombies would never mention on iPodLounge.

[CortJstr]

I've considered switching to ogg many times as it gives better quality/size and is totally open source and thus doesn't have mp3's licensing problems. But the lack of support for this free standard constantly amazes me.

The iTunes thing was more of a generic comment than directed at you. The average user would need to use either it (or MusicMatch but it hurt me just to type that). But you're right, there are many other "hacked" players that work with it.

I'd still go with a 3rd party to buy your case. Apple charges as much for plain nylon (which name w/ mine) as other companies charge for swankier "open face" ones. I have one of the ones where the buttons are totally exposed but recessed. I didn't like the feel of the ones that put a film over even the touch-sensitive areas. And as I said, get a screen protector if you don't get a sleeve.

In the 3G you can turn off the sound-effect click noise in the Settings menu. I turned it off after about 10 minutes, once I was used to the feel of the touch wheel.

I'm guessing you're aware of the iPod file system, right? How mp3's are synched and stored differently than other files to make it harder to mass move songs.

[St_Zartan]

* Big. For most everybody a 20/40 GB will hold ever song you own even the shit you never listen to like TV show theme songs.

Spoken like someone without THE THEME FROM THE ROCKFORD FILES

[V-Adore]

* Big. For most everybody a 20/40 GB will hold ever song you own even the shit you never listen to like TV show theme songs.

Spoken like someone without THE THEME FROM THE ROCKFORD FILES

A dear friend swears by -- absolutely swears by -- the "Tic Tac Dough" theme. I can't totally claim he's wrong.

Me, I recently acquired an MP3 of the "Where in the World is Carmen Sandiego?" theme, and it rocks my tiny, nostalgic world. Admittedly, this is probably singlehandedly responsible for my generation's perverse idea that a capella is not intrinsically worthless, but ah well.

[jough]

Well, I have 185Gb of mp3s now.  So 20-40 Gb will only hold the stuff I really like.  And not even all of it.

But 40Gb will hold me for even the longest road trip, I'm sure.  Even at the ludicrously high bitrate I'm ripping at now I'll still be able to fit about 5-7000 songs on it.

Oh, and as far as headphones go, I don't even plan to open the packaging for the included earbuds.

Don't go knocking ear buds, though - my Sony 888s have held me in good stead for years, and I've heard good things about these isolating IN-ear canal phones that are supposed to be phenomenal.  However, they go so far into your ear that I'm sure most people would be freaked out by them.  They have the added "bonus" of shutting out all outside sound.

I'm well familiar with how the iPod handles files.  It's crippling is so easy to circumvent and just use the thing properly that it's silly.  There's even a way to catalogue the files in-player so you can just copy MP3s over to it in your own folder system and then have the player index itself (which is a feature of the iRiver and Rio Carbon as well).

Some funny man even found a way to put a stripped-down version of Linux on it.  Good stuff.

Can't wait.  I have to, though - I won't be able to justify the expense until the end of the month.

[slink]

I'm gonna go with the Jet Adio 40gb when I get round to it. I refuse to buy one that means I end up using DRM fomats. JetAudio supports mp3, ogg and wma, has the same storage space, and in my opinion looks and functions better than the iPod.

[CortJstr]

Yikes. See I just use --alt preset standard so my files are roughly 192VBR. Plus I generally only rip the songs I actually like so that cuts down my folder size.

I can never get earbuds to actually stay in my ears. I haven't tried the in-ear phones but I always wear rubber ear plugs to concerts so I don't think the sensation would bother me. I haven't tried them because blocking all outside sounds at work would be a bad idea and I've heard the fidelity is too good for medium bitrate mp3's, which I still have a few of.

I used the Apple financing for mine. It's essentially an MBNA credit card with 0% for 60 days.

And V, thank you so much for getting freaking Rockapella stuck in my head. If you'll excuse me I'm going to fire up my iPod and listen to the Ramones cover of the Spider-Man theme to fix that.

[Va]

I need a new mp3 player, too, but I'm irrationally anti-proprietary, and using iTunes is not an option for me.  Can anyone recommend a high capacity non-Apple player?  What I have now is an Archos Jukebox Multimedia.  We abused it by leaving it laying around for a year or more without using it and now the battery won't hold a charge.

UPDATE: Just noticed that slink did implicitly make such a recommendation.

[CortJstr]

What I don't get is how many people buy an iPod then suddenly start going crazy in the iTunes music store. I can't fathom buying songs with DRM just becaues they go with my player.

[Va]

I don't understand how all the other online music stores can get away with their highway robbery when there's eMusic.

[V-Adore]

And V, thank you so much for getting freaking Rockapella stuck in my head. If you'll excuse me I'm going to fire up my iPod and listen to the Ramones cover of the Spider-Man theme to fix that.

Look, blame the friend of mine who gave me a mix with Rockapella on it. (This is a mix so fantastically random and infectious that I'm tempted to burn copies of it to send as pack-ins with my actual mix.)

also, I have gone through the last four or five days with "the WARRANT! the WARRANT!" popping into my head at random times, so my suffering should be shared by all.

[jough]

Oh, it's easy.  eMusic hardly has any new music that most people want.

If they had more they'd sell more.

For instance, I wanted the new Prince album.  It was only available via various DRM download sites, so I didn't buy it online.

I've lately been buying new CDs for about $9.99, ripping them to a very high bitrate, and selling the discs for $5-6.  The local M&P knows that I do this and give me a little more money back on new releases if I bring them back a day or so later.  So my "downloads" end up costing me $3-4 per album.

I always rip the entire album whenever I have a CD since my rips are meant to REPLACE the album for me.  At 256-320kbps the rips are practically lossless.

I am planning to buy an iPod and I plan to never ever use AAC unless they have free downloads of something.

The only proprietary "locked" format I'm considering is Audible.com audio books, but I already have a utility to strip them of their DRM-ness and just work as regular mp3s.

I also have already looked at iTunes, found it HORRIBLE and inadequate, and have uninstalled it already.  I will never use iTunes with my iPod.

[CortJstr]

If you're going for replacement then why don't you use some kind of lossless codec like Monkeys Audio?