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Author Topic: brining  (Read 6087 times)

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Freddie Fractions

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brining
« on: August 01, 2003, 03:50:11 pm »

Ooh how exciting to initiate the new tastes forum!  

Anyway, the other day I had some chicken breasts I wanted to cook just for myself - nothing fancy.  Since Ray brines his ruuuuuude chicken I figured why not.  I've always got water, salt, sugar, and random spice/flavor additives and so all it takes is a little planning ahead.  So I brined them for a little under 24 hours and they were definitely better than usual, but not amazing.  Do multiple days really make the difference?  Can someone explain the science behind this?  Normal marinades usually only need an hour or two at most for optimum effect.
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jay-ell

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« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2003, 04:05:11 pm »

I'm thinking the difference between a marinade and a brine is that a marinade imparts flavor, but a brine imparts tenderness.  I've never messed with brining, but when I get home I'll check my old copies of Cook's Illustrated to see if I can find any info.  

Maybe somebody wants to run a web search on this?
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Freddie Fractions

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brining
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2003, 06:13:04 pm »

dropping science
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The salt has two effects on poultry, reports Dr. Alan Sams, a professor of poultry science at Texas A & M University. "It dissolves protein in muscle, and the salt and protein reduce moisture loss during cooking. This makes the meat juicer, more tender, and improves the flavor. The low levels of salt enhance the other natural flavors of poultry."

Not that this really explains much.  I just like that there is such a thing as a professor of poultry science.
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Choop

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Re: brine
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2003, 03:40:24 pm »

Quote from: "jldunston"
a marinade imparts flavor, but a brine imparts tenderness.


Marinades add flavor, brines accentuate flavor already there.
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slink

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brining
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2003, 06:23:07 pm »

You just have to remember not to brine a salt cured ham!!
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AlohaDawg

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« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2003, 11:11:07 pm »

I've brined a lot; I think it really adds to the flavor and texture. Most of the brines I've seen and used involved an acid as well as the salt - citrus juice is very good. Since I live where I can get them, I use Lilikoi (passionfruit) juice and it is AWESOME. So when you guys come visit for the Game of 1000 Cards I'll brine up and smoke a coupla ducks. It's my favorite.

Kiawe Smoked Duck with Sweet Lilikoi Sauce

Ducks:
2 4.5 – 5 lb ducks

Duck Preparation:

Brine:
a quart of lilikoi juice or passion-orange juice - any acidy fruit juice you like will probably do.
˝ cup kosher salt

You can also use a quart of water and 1/2 cup each kosher salt and sugar.

Sauce:
Neckbones from duck
1 can lilikoi  juice
Red wine
Sachet of herbs
Salt and pepper

Smoke:
Kiawe wood chips soaked in water OR
Mesquite if kiawe is unavailable

Thaw and rinse the ducks. Reserve the necks. Set aside giblets for another purpose.

Brine the ducks  each in 1 Quart juice, ˝ cup kosher salt

EITHER:
Brine for 3-8 hours under refrigeration with fruit juice brine, OR

If using water, salt and sugar, rinse ducks after brining and score skin being careful not to pierce through to the muscle.

Marinading, not brining method: Place each duck in a pan and pour a can of juice over each.   Rub duck with salt and pepper. Score skin. Marinate under refrigeration 4-8 hours, turning occasionally.

Smoke ducks using Kiawe wood (or mesquite) until internal temperature (thigh) reaches about 170 degrees. Use a probe if you have one, it will change your life and your relationship with grilled meats.

Meanwhile, place necks in small saucepan with 3 cups water. Simmer slowly and skim foam. After skimming foam, cook necks down for stock with onion and carrots. Keep simmering til there is not much foam and remove the necks.

Add a sachet of herbs; I used parsley and thyme and peppercorns. (a small amount of rosemary may be good with strong flavor of duck as well)
Remove from heat after about 40 minutes; strain.  Return to heat and cook down to about 1 cup.

In separate pan, cook lilikuoi juice down to 1 cup. Mix the reduced stock and reduced juice together and add a splash of red wine. Further reduce. Salt and pepper to taste; if thickening is desired use slurry of cornstarch over low heat.

Serve carved duck with sauce.

Bonus way to dispose of leftover duck meat:

Leftover Duck Pasta

Lilikoi sauce and duck
Chiffonade of fresh basil
Penne pasta
Roasted garlic (sweet) if you have it
Red/green roasted pepper if you have it
Sweet onion if you have it
Butter or olive oil

Cut leftover duck meat into medium dice.  
Boil Penne Pasta in salted water.
Saute vegetables in a small pan in butter or olive oil. When vegetables are done yet firm to the bite, add duck and basil to heat through.  Toss this mixture with leftover lilikuoi sauce and pasta. Add salt and fresh ground black pepper to taste. Sweet, yet savory, and smoky.  Very tasty.
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yahnai

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« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2003, 06:20:47 pm »

dawg.  that is a tight recipie.
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Carlos del Vaca

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brining
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2003, 01:23:46 pm »

Brining is the way to go on Thanksgiving as well.  It makes for a moist and tasty bird.  We did this one a couple years ago, and it was smashing.
http://www.epicurious.com/run/recipe/view?id=102478
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AlohaDawg

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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2003, 07:31:10 pm »

The above recipe looks great, but whatever you do, DO NOT COOK TURKEY TO 180 DEGREES like the recipe says....

This is a ridiculously high temperature - if the breast is at 180 degrees, the legs, thighs and other parts are completely destroyed. Most guides tell you to cook poultry to 165 degrees. I usually cook to 160 and let it rest 5-10 minutes before carving. Turkey dries out pretty fast

Remember that the temperature will continue to rise after you take the bird out of the oven. Invest in a probe that you leave in the meat as it cooks and alerts you when it gets to a selected temp, I use one for the oven and the grill and the results are a thousand times better than trying to cook for time or appearance.
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jough

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brining
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2003, 11:54:56 pm »

They have this big deep-frying thing which can cook a whole turkey in about 40 minutes.

Since the oil is very very hot (at least 350 degs.) the oil comes right out of the bird as soon as you pull it out of the oil.  It is not greasy at all and in fact is TREMENDOUSLY tender and delicious.

I can't really eat turkey cooked any other way now.  The cost is only about $50 for both the fryer and oil (peanut oil can get ridiculously hot and not burn, and is re-usable) and you will thank me.

jay-ell

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« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2003, 01:55:46 am »

This month's Bon Appetit has an awesome article on various techniques to cook a turkey without drying it out, which includes a sidebar on deep-frying.  The article says that the key is to shield the breast and cook the white meat only to 160 degrees, at which point the dark meat will be about 180 and therefore safe.  

I rarely recommend that people buy magazines off the rack, but if you're not a subscriber and ever plan to cook a large Thanksgiving meal, this one is worth having in your files.  It is the November issue, which may not be out on the newsstands yet.
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AugustWest

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« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2003, 02:14:20 am »

Presently I have a 20 pound turkey thawing in the fridgemator getting ready for Thursday.  Tomorrow night I intend to start brining that bad boy.  Any suggestions as to what liquid I should use.

I'm leaning toward lime juice at the moment, but I'm open to suggestions.

You should also know that I will be grilling this turkey over charcoal and mesquite chips.  Also that I am a Scorpio.  

That second part is probably pretty irrelevant, actually.
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AlohaDawg

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« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2003, 02:25:26 am »

Lime juice sounds strong. I usually use something with acid and sugar, but less astringent...like my choice above, which I realize may not be available everywhere, Lilikoi (Passionfruit) juice.  You could use guava or POG, Passion-orange-Guava.

The lime might be good, though, too....I just think I would want something sweeter to balance the sour.

Make sure to post your recipe if it's awesome.
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