The OFFICIAL Unofficial Achewood Message Board
Trivial Pursuits => People & Places => Topic started by: Muse_Of_Fire on March 13, 2007, 02:59:41 am
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Howdy, fellow Sick Fucks and Hot Nerd Girls.
Without going into a big long story, due to dumb outdated rules and politics with my job, and dumb bad luck with Mr. Muse's job, we're considering up and moving. My principal loves me, I have stellar reviews, and basically by every measure there is, I am an awesome teacher (please excuse the bragging--we get so few opportunities for it in my profession); but the politics of seniority, and budget cuts, being what they are, my days working in my current district, or even nearby districts, are numbered.
So we have decided to seriously consider moving. We decided that if job opportunities don't come up, we'll move after this coming school year (or sooner if my Linguistics class--that project I was talking about in this other thread (http://touamb.com/index.php/topic,3489.0.html)--falls through). We have a general idea of where we might want to go, but we're willing to entertain lots of options and are interested in learning more about what's out there. We also decided that if we move, we're going to *really* move and go far away, so out of state is no big deal.
What we're looking for (in no particular order):
1. A city of at least 250k people.
2. Clean air/water, lots of greenspace. Lakes and/or ocean presence is a plus.
3. Low crime
4. LOTS of cultural opportunities. I have to live in a city with a ballet company and a real dance scene and theatre scene, and art galleries/museums. This is not negotiable.
5. Lots of excellent restaurants. I have to live in a "foodie" city. Also not negotiable.
6. Progressive/liberal vibe. I don't need to live in hippie-town, but Mr. Muse and I are both lefties so it would be nice to be in a place that is at least tolerant of "blue" folks.
7. High value on education. A university town or at least a place with really good schools and/or a high percentage of people with college degrees and beyond.
8. Strong economy/positive job market.
9. Good housing market/growth (we want to eventually buy a condo in an urban area)
10. Jobs for a dedicated, progressive teacher; and an attorney who specializes in contracts, business law, and copyright.
11. Smoking bans are a plus, but not required.
12. Vibrant "fitness" culture: lots of gyms, yoga studios, bike and jogging trails, etc.
13: High number of average days of sunlight per year. This is *critical* because I have a mood disorder.
Some background: Our current household income is about $30k and on that we are able to afford a just-under-1000 sq-foot 2BR/2 Bath apartment in a nice area, the occasional night out, relatively upscale meals at home once or twice a week. We generally don't spend money on things like new clothes very often. I'd like to have a little more in my pocket at the end of the pay period but we're certainly not uncomfortable. We have two cars (newest one is a 2004, the older one is paid for), and about $100k in student loan debt between us. So we'd like to go somewhere where the cost of living will be comparable.
Any suggestions? Where have you lived? Did you like it there? Based on what I've shared, do you think I'd like it there?
I dunno. Suggestions welcome.
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NoVa is desperate for teachers and they can't build schools fast enough. But $30K will not come even close to cutting it here. Close to DC a 2/2 will cost you $2,500/month in rent alone. Farther out things get cheaper. But then you're living farther out.
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NoVa is desperate for teachers and they can't build schools fast enough. But $30K will not come even close to cutting it here. Close to DC a 2/2 will cost you $2,500/month in rent alone. Farther out things get cheaper. But then you're living farther out.
Well, how much do teachers make there? I'm just quoting my salary here where we live currently since I'm the sole income for us since Mr. Muse still hasn't found work. If teacher pay is commensurate with the cost of living then it could work. I used to live near DC (but in MD); although I can't remember what I paid for an apartment there. Assuming Mr. Muse can find work at all, we should be good. What's it like living there? The Richmond area is on our list, but we don't know much about the rest of the state.
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Louisville is affordable and meets most of the standards you listed. As far as opportunities for attornies go, any that I know about I'm using for myself.
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I am sure you know that a place that fits all of those criteria does not exist anywhere unless you are incredibly rich.
If though as you say "culture" and "sunlight" are the non-negotiables along with "size"? You're basically down to... coastal California or the more urban parts of Arizona. LA or Phoenix.
And LA isn't affordable, low-crime or clean.
And Phoenix isn't affordable, progressive, much of a food town or all that cultural.
San Diego... is for people who can deal with having to drive three hours to LA to do anything actually cool. Tucson... possibly fits the most of your criteria but is way too small.
Most of your criteria screams "Pacific Northwest or Toronto" but... if sunlight is a deal breaker, you're kind of fucked there.
San Fran seems better than you'd think, considering that it is nearly as expensive as LA but the weather is disturbingly Bostonian and from my friends that live there, it seems to be much more crime-y than the postcards would suggest.
Pretty much, you're gonna need to either go to Portland and buy a SOSAD lamp or go to Tucson and deal with the facts of living in a one-hoss town or... go to Phoenix and be mindcrushingly bored or... go to LA and accept that the only way to not be poor in LA is to be completely unethical.
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Heh.
The place I described does exist, save for the job availability. I live there now. ;) I'd like to have a bit more sunlight per year here too, but it's doable as it is.
LA is right out. I will not live there. Won't won't won't. I have friends in SoCal, and some family too, and I can't stand being there even for short visits.
SanFran area is on our list, and pretty high, although SanFran proper is too expensive. We're thinking maybe Oakland or Santa Rosa or someplace thereabouts. A lot of people have suggested Richmond and also, surprisingly enough, Atlanta. I know a little about Richmond, having friends and family there, but nothing about Atlanta. Boston has also been suggested but I'm hesitant. I used to live in DC and wouldn't mind going back there, but I'm guessing the job prospects for attorneys are pretty slim there.
Also on the list:
Nashville
Pretty much any city of a Certain Size that is between the SF Bay and the Oregon border
Toronto (sunlight is an issue)
Portland, OR (sunlight, again; I have family there and grew up not far from there though so I like the area save for the clouds)
Cincinnatti
I dunno. The idea of a "list" is pretty arbitrary at this point since we're currently in the phase of "create the preliminary list."
Still, I appreciate everyone's candid comments.
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Nashville is pretty nice. Big music culture there, mostly centered around Country music (duh). On the expensive side of Middle-American cities.
Cincy. You would not like Cincinnatti. EXTREMELY conservative. Check out Columbus maybe...
Um, have you ever lived between the coasts? It's my life and all I know, but I'm certainly aware that there a large cultural disconnect involved. Not that you wouldn't like it -- there's lots to recommend it. But based on every coaster I've known, there's a big adjustment involved. N.B. a substantial proportion of 'em have chosen to move here permanently...
I would also suggest you look at your ~250K guideline. Where I live there might be 2000 people within a 5 mile radius. But there's a town of 20,000 only 6 miles away. The state capital (30,000) is 10 miles away. The largest city in the state (a.k.a. the 16th largest in the country) is half an hour down the road. Another city of 250,000 is half an hour in the other direction. Cincinnati is 90 minutes away. Indianapolis and Nashville are about 3 hours away. Chicago and St Louis are about 5 hours away.
It's a different mindset. But there are cultural opportunities here. And it's unquestionably cheaper.
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There are many towns in new jersey that meet at least 80-90% of your criteria. Most of new jersey is progressive liberal. All of new jersey has a smoking ban indoors. NJ is one of the best educated states in the nation and there are numerous "university towns" varying from princeton to new brunswick (rutgers). Almost anything you can imagine is within reach of NJTransit into the city. I think Hoboken or new brunswick sounds exactly like what youre looking for. Hoboken is one of these towns on the rise after a long period of downtime it is now being revived by trendy young folks. New Jersey isnt just the turnpike.
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Thanks, my bulbous but tapered associate. :)
I currently do live between the coasts. I love it here, except for the utter lack of jobs. In my lifetime I've lived on both coasts and in the middle, and I like them all. There are good and bad places everywhere, so as long as I can meet most of the criteria listed, the actual region doesn't matter much to me. In fact, if there was a way to for us to stay in the middle where we currently live, I'd totally do it. But the job prospects aren't looking too good.
As to the city size, I'm standing firm on that one. I have lived in cities of millions and cities that barely had a thousand people, and no matter how close the nearest urban center is, it's too far if I'm not living right in it. Growing up in some small towns, I came to appreciate them, but now that I'm an adult I've discovered that I'm most definitely a city girl. During Mr. Muse's last year of law school, circumstances dictated that we live in a small town of <1k people, 45 minutes from the nearest urban center. I worked in said city, so I was there every day, but still I thought I was going to DIE. I will never, ever, ever do that again. I'm a city person through and through, and if I have to drive more than 10 minutes to find a Thai restaurant or an indie coffee house, it's too far. Maybe that makes me a snob, but so be it. Such is my personality. I need the kind of crazy stimulation that city life provides.
Interestingly, A-CAP, several other people have mentioned New Jersey to me. I must admit that the state's reputation isn't so great and so the idea of living there doesn't appeal to me, but everyone who's recommended it has said glowing things, so it's worth at least a look. I'll add it to our "to be investigated" list.
Thanks for these perspectives, all; honestly they are helping a great deal. I solve problems by talking them out with others as sounding boards, so this is rockin'. Plus I get firsthand testimonials! Rad. :)
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There are REALLY nice parts of New Jersey, yes.
The problem falls upon the fact that... the really nice parts of New Jersey are pretty much as expensive as LA or the Bay Area except that the weather is crap... and you're functionally as far as hell from the cultural events Mof is talking about.
This is going to sound completely like what you would expect from a person who grew up in a small farm town and now lives in Los Angeles but it is exactly what I believe:
Anywhere you have to go where the most efficient way of getting there is a bus or a subway pretty much isn't worth going to. Buses and subways are pretty much completely disgusting.
This is the reason I'll never get my 100% Liberal card. I don't care SO much about the environment that I'm gonna get on a bus or a subway. If I ever get money, I'll get a hybrid. I carpool whenever possible.
But, man, fuck public transportation. It is all germs and creepiness.
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St Louis seems pretty hardcore awesome-- all my friends who are from there Love it. But I don't know how well it fits the other categories. Crime is a problem in the not-good areas, but I believe it is pretty safe in the nice ones (Clayton, University City)
Charlotte is...
1. A city of at least 250k people.
2. Clean air/water, lots of greenspace. Lakes and/or ocean presence is a plus.
3. Low crime
4. Not so many cultural opportunities. But it's getting better.
5. I don't know restaurants. Probably not, but again, getting better
6. I would say it's reasonably tolerant... I think Charlotte has gone Blue in recent elections.
7. Generally shitty public schools (though there -are- some good ones)-- 3 good private ones that I can think of.
8. Strong economy/positive job market.--Hell yes, Growing a lot.
9. Good housing market/growth (we want to eventually buy a condo in an urban area)
10. I know they have jobs for teachers at the public schools, but you might not want to get into that. The private schools are good, just not... certain ones. I won't name names unless you ask, but certain schools apparently have a "snobby old money" thing going on that is just bullshit.
11. I doubt there is a smoking ban.
12. Vibrant "fitness" culture: lots of gyms, yoga studios, bike and jogging trails, etc.---Yep!
13: High number of average days of sunlight per year.
indie coffee houses: yes, downtown.
Thai Restaurants: umm... there's a good one south of downtown... and... I think maybe another one? Somewhere?
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One more thing, though? If I had gobs and gobs of money? I'd live in the rich suburbs of Albany, NY.
College town, cheap living, clean, lotsa open spaces... great culturally for a town around 150,000... a stable economic base because of being the state capital, liberal as hell for the same reason... if for some God-unknown reason, you WANNA do the NYC or Boston things, it's an easy day-trip.
Pretty much the only downside is the weather which... if you'd consider New Jersey or Boston's weather within the realm of reason, Albany has pretty much the same sunlight as those places.
Only reason I'm not living in Albany is that I wanna be a screenwriter and... you know... for that, it's Los Angeles or New York City. And New York City frightens the hell out of my shit.
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Thanks, my bulbous but tapered associate. :)
I currently do live between the coasts. I love it here, except for the utter lack of jobs. In my lifetime I've lived on both coasts and in the middle, and I like them all. There are good and bad places everywhere, so as long as I can meet most of the criteria listed, the actual region doesn't matter much to me.
My sentiments exactly. I'm so happy to hear you say this. I'd love to hear more exactly where you are now.
During Mr. Muse's last year of law school, circumstances dictated that we live in a small town of <1k people, 45 minutes from the nearest urban center. I worked in said city, so I was there every day, but still I thought I was going to DIE. I will never, ever, ever do that again.
Yeah, yikes. That's too far. Understand that having a law career complicates issues. I'm a city person through and through, and if I have to drive more than 10 minutes to find a Thai restaurant or an indie coffee house, it's too far.
Good Thai restaurant, 20 minutes. Also, good Persian restaurant, same distance. Tons of great restaurants of most any conceivable stripe or ethnicity, 30-45 minutes.
Also, a ballet company, an opera company, a good to very good independant band atmosphere and one of the best theatre scenes in the county.
I'm not really trying to get you to come here specifically. My point is that there are cultural opportunities everywhere. I'm just suggesting that perhaps you should check out places you wouldn't think of at first blush. I live in a very small place, but they still deliver The New Yorker here every week.
Also, consider that maybe you are destined to bring culture to deprived areas. Be a dang ol' Mother Theresa of The Dance to Podunk Springs. There are little kids there that need you.
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There are REALLY nice parts of New Jersey, yes.
The problem falls upon the fact that... the really nice parts of New Jersey are pretty much as expensive as LA or the Bay Area except that the weather is crap... and you're functionally as far as hell from the cultural events Mof is talking about.
This is going to sound completely like what you would expect from a person who grew up in a small farm town and now lives in Los Angeles but it is exactly what I believe:
Anywhere you have to go where the most efficient way of getting there is a bus or a subway pretty much isn't worth going to. Buses and subways are pretty much completely disgusting.
This is the reason I'll never get my 100% Liberal card. I don't care SO much about the environment that I'm gonna get on a bus or a subway. If I ever get money, I'll get a hybrid. I carpool whenever possible.
But, man, fuck public transportation. It is all germs and creepiness.
The towns i mentioned (also Newark) are all full of culture and easily traversed via auto.
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Yeah, yikes. That's too far. Understand that having a law career complicates issues. Good Thai restaurant, 20 minutes. Also, good Persian restaurant, same distance. Tons of great restaurants of most any conceivable stripe or ethnicity, 30-45 minutes.
Also, a ballet company, an opera company, a good to very good independant band atmosphere and one of the best theatre scenes in the county.
I'm not really trying to get you to come here specifically. My point is that there are cultural opportunities everywhere. I'm just suggesting that perhaps you should check out places you wouldn't think of at first blush. I live in a very small place, but they still deliver The New Yorker here every week.
Also, consider that maybe you are destined to bring culture to deprived areas. Be a dang ol' Mother Theresa of The Dance to Podunk Springs. There are little kids there that need you.
I dig it. If you must know, I live in Madison, WI. I looooooooooooove it here. Love love love it. We would stay if we could get work, but it's looking less and less probable as time goes by. We've both lived here for over ten years (save for some little "blips" to finish education requirements and career options), and it has everything we want except jobs.
I'm totally interested in places that I wouldn't normally think of at first blush. SF Bay area, Richmond, Raleigh... these are cities that popped in our heads when we were first considering moving. But we're aware that there are little gems everywhere that we might not even know about, which is why we're asking our net associates to give us suggestions. :) So far all the suggestions I've received are at least worth investigating. So if you have a specific city in mind, AugustWest, lay it on me. :)
In terms of bringing the culture to deprived areas... nooooo. Been there, done that. I'm too old to do it again. But your other points are more than vaild.
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Nashville is a pretty nice town and I know of some really excellent (pricey) restaurants, though I don't like Thai so I have no ideas on that front for you. It is liveable on $30k, though probably not the most liberal-friendly. It is the state capital so there are plenty of law firms. There is much green space.
Has no one mentioned Austin? Seems to be bang-on for you.
While I love San Diego and the weather would suit you incredibly well (81 and cloud-free today), you can't own property here if you make less than $60k, or $100 if you want that low-crime vibe. Likewise Palm Springs may fit many cultural criteria but it is getting expensive to live there, as well. I'm also doubting the lawyer need is very high.
I'd suggest Vegas (which is about to hit a housing glut, I think) if it weren't for the fact you probably want real culture and that whole crime thing.
My hometown is Birmingham, AL, which has a lot going for it but is way short on cultural opportunities. My dad does know just about every lawyer working there, though... so jobs exist.
I am going to do more research and post again later.
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oh, yes, also look into Raleigh and Chapel Hill. they are wonderful, in my experience.
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It would certainly increase your cost of living, but the place you described to me is in Brooklyn, NY, notably Williamsburg. The only problem is the hipster kids so corny they don't deserve oxygen.
If you think this is feasible, act asap because the property value is basically skyrocketing.
Man, Sunday night I got a blackened catgiraffe sandwhich so good it made me want to do inappropriate things at the table.
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I've lived in both No and So Cal so I'm going to be bold and say this for Cali:
Don't come here.
I'm going to add an appendum now: Yet.
Starting teacher in the 34 -> 42k range will have you living in squalor, with no guarantee of a second income. I'm not in L.A. and my area meets all of your criteria but you need to be yanking 90k to have a home and a life.
The Bay Area is just as bad (actually worse) in regards to cost of living. S.F. proper has been at 100% housing capacity for 15 years and cost is astronomical. This has made the down peninsula cost (Daly City for example) skyrocket as well. The golden triangle of Dublin, Livermore and Ramon is now just as impacted and north up-bay like Petaluma are a lockout. Richmond is in the same boat and is not nice as well. I've stayed there and will brook no argument. SJ valley places like Merced, Modesto, Clovis, Fresno, Sacto, Stockton are all cheaper but very limited in opportunity and don't fulfill 1/2 your wish list.when you get up north to places like/around Eureka you hit small town/longs ways syndrome. That doesn't sound like what you want.
The Cali trap for you is this: you could afford Palm Desert but have to scrap 2/3'rds of your wants. You can't come to the coast without experiencing financial and lifestyle hardship. Hell, to give a southern example, you could maybe swing Escondido but still be locked out of a lot of your wants because of distance/convenience. It's even more stark in NoCal, where there is less in all ways the further in you go. Lower wages, fewer jobs, less housing choices, just dang all less.
If you want comfort, come to Cali when you're career established and have some ca$h in your pocket. we'll be glad to help you spend it.
My list of options:
Tucson
Santa Fe
Phoenix
Grand Rapids, MI.
Atlanta
Lexington, KY.
And I couldn't agree w/ AW more on Cincy. Lived there for two months and chose unemployment over following my company there. Staying to the central meat of the country might just be a fine idea.
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To be fair, my girlfriend is gonna be a starting teacher in September and is gonna start at like... 60K. Los Angeles's poorer schools need teachers that badly. The flipside, of course, is that there is also less room for salary growth than in most places. Start higher, top out lower.
Los Angeles is not a place to raise a kid. At all. Even if you're rich. Christ, ESPECIALLY if you're rich. Those private schools in the hills seem to be adept at turning out a particular kind of sociopath.
But if you're not looking to own your home in any way and you're not looking to grow any homo sapiens larve, you can get by financially in a pretty okay fashion.
This is not the place to find the American Dream with the white picket fence and the minivan. That is somewhere else, if it even exists anymore. If it ever existed at all, if it wasn't just a piece of hossshit devised to sell radio plays and keep the underclass at each others' throats.
This is the place to come if you have a chip on your shoulder about being an outsider as a teenager and you're either gonna show them all by becoming a god or die trying, toothless in a ditch outside of a Ralph's. One way or the other.
This is the place where the ghosts of losing lottery tickets come to rage against the cruel dire fates that branded them with numbers that meant nothing... or at least meant nothing that's redeemable in a state lottery office or a Seven-Eleven. Looking for redemption at the feet of God in Her most seductive form, as Stubborn Luck, and failing that to know that you have taken a slash at Her pristine ankles for Her unkindness before you breathe your last.
Rabid desperation, savage and beautiful. The whore who never lets you stray but always makes you pay. It is not a game for people who want a thing they own forever or a child to survive the wreckage of their faded obsessions. Madness, pure and dark, sick and true.
Mount the Goddess or die clawing at Her heels. It sounds crazy.
But it's pretty much the only thing I ever really wanted that wasn't completely easy. So I dig it.
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nice.
I would like to mention, I have heard rumours of a planned Linguistics class at my alma mater.
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I don't know, but I think maybe Austin. Or Lawrence (no less about here, hate the rest of Kansas.)
Norman (the town I am in), OK, is actually alright, meeting all but a couple of your requirements.
Actually, now that I think about it, Tulsa is a pretty great town, and probably the town I will live in if i stay in Oklahoma.
I am not sure on size, it has a decent amount of culture, parks, decent restaurants (great pubs), college town, fairly liberal, at least tolerant, sun, cheap, teacher positions and a statewide smoking ban. I don't know about fitness culture, but you can find a gym easily. Crime is a problem in a very small part of the town, but generally contained.
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It would certainly increase your cost of living, but the place you described to me is in Brooklyn, NY, notably Williamsburg.
On a schoolteacher's salary? I don't think this is even possible anymore. And forget about Boston too.
Coming late to this, and sort of hung over due to much drinking over my own job situation so maybe I am confused, but - your TOTAL income is 30k including your SO being a lawyer? How is this possible? Is this one of those things I don't understand from always living in a big coastal city?
Do you think he'd make more in a bigger city or is he one of those lefty public service types who doesn't make real lawyer money? I would also rule out the DC area unless the lawyer is going to get a real lawyer-paying DC sort of job. I know people who try to live on 30k kind of money - basically what it means is commuting to their DC job from someplace over an hour away. It's not a pretty sight.
Now Baltimore, on the other hand - you can still live there on a reasonable amount of money. Probably doesn't meet your low crime criteria and as for the public schools, um, well maybe you can teach in a private school? But otherwise it is a cool place, I totally have a crush on Baltimore.
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Also, I can't help but notice that, no matter who supports cigarette bans, they are not really liberal.
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Well, how much do teachers make there? I'm just quoting my salary here where we live currently since I'm the sole income for us since Mr. Muse still hasn't found work. If teacher pay is commensurate with the cost of living then it could work. I used to live near DC (but in MD); although I can't remember what I paid for an apartment there. Assuming Mr. Muse can find work at all, we should be good. What's it like living there? The Richmond area is on our list, but we don't know much about the rest of the state.
My mom is a public school teacher but she has in year 36 or 37 so she isn't exactly starting salary. Most of the teaching jobs are in Fairfax and Loudoun counties which have much cheaper rents than I mentioned early because you'd be 30-60 minutes from DC (closer to 90 from Baltimore). Fairfax sounds a lot more your speed in terms of amenities and politics, though. Plus we are one of the states who recently decided to completey redefine the word "marriage."
There are plenty of law-talkin' jobs here. A friend got a swank job at the SEC right out of law school and has more money than he knows what to do with. Another option is non-profits. There's a metric ass-ton of non-profits based in the area an many have legal departments or at least staff counsel. The pay is lower but a 40-hour work week is also much more likely than at a firm.
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These are awesome suggestions and great input, guys. Thank you so much, it's helping a lot.
Wombat, the $30k is because I'm the only one working right now. My husband just graduated from law school and where we live has the most lawyers per capita than almost anywhere. So no one is hiring. That's the whole reason we want to move. He can't find anything anywhere, and my job is unstable because of the seniority structure (the dumbest idea for educators EVER, IMO) and budget cuts.
It's starting to tick both of us off that we can't get stable work. We are two of the most capable and educated people on the planet for our age bracket--
Me: Degrees in Linguistics and French. Will have a degree in Spanish by the end of this summer. Teaching license grades 6-12. Will have a K-5 teaching license by the end of this summer. Fluent in French and Spanish, working knowledge of German, basic skills in Russian and Mandarin Chinese. I also read Italian and Portuguese. Corporate experience in translation and localization fields (5 years) prior to four years of outstanding teacher service. Also a professional dancer and ballet teacher. Also a semi-professional caterer. And that's just the stuff I can put on paper.
My husband: Degrees in psychology, theology, and political science. Master's in theology. Juris doctor. Started his own ISP in 1993 which is now (after mergers and acquisitions) one of the largest in our area and part of an international communications company. CCNA certified. 10 years of entrepreneurial and technology management experience prior to law school. And that's just what he can put on paper.
If I think about it too much I start to get Pissed At The World(TM) and that's unhealthy and unproductive. But dammit.... DAMMIT!
So yeah, that's why we're feeling restless. We want to go somewhere where we're wanted. Actually, I'm wanted at my current school, but I'm being shoved out by bureaucracy, so... yeah.
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Does the place have to be that large? Because if you leave the size figure out what your list makes me think of is Northampton, Mass.
Actually the first thing your list made me think was to wonder what kind of drugs you were on. I am surprised that such a place exists. I was relieved to find that it was in a location where the winters would kill me, so I didn't have to want to move there.
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I'd be frustrated in that situation as well. Y'all need a bigger pool of opportunity to draw from. Sounds like your spouse needs to be in an area with a nice broad base of established technical industies with a need for in house counsel. Combine the past experience with the educational achievement. You, with four years of teaching experience and your language skills, can pull an additional bonus putting you in the 42 -> 46k range in California to teach. You can hit 50k if you add a post-grad on Cali's dime while you work.
With the additional info I've changed my mind.
What you should do is come to Cali and rent a duplex next to Onstad. Live thin for two years until your settled in the career groove and then you'll be flying fine.
And stalk Onstad's doggie for Wombat.
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I live in Portland, and yeah the weather can be shitty, but we got pretty much all the rest of that. I live within 10 minutes of great restaurants (Thai, Indian, Mediterranean, Cuban, Ethiopian, etc) and coffee shops, and concert venues, the bike shop, music stores . . . and that's walking distance. We have great public transportation. I'm not sure what the bus hate was upthread, but I really haven't had trouble with public transportation except in really big cities. Our buses and trains are clean and in good repair, and they will get you anywhere you want to go with alacrity.
Average annual chance of sunshine per day in Portland = 48%. In Madison WI = 54%. Something to consider.
Information from here. (http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/online/ccd/avgsun.html)
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What you should do is come to Cali and rent a duplex next to Onstad. Live thin for two years until your settled in the career groove and then you'll be flying fine.
And stalk Onstad's doggie for Wombat.
Now there's a plan!
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Does the place have to be that large? Because if you leave the size figure out what your list makes me think of is Northampton, Mass.
Muse:This was going to be my suggestion. Having spent a few years there, I can tell you that the Pioneer Valley is hell of awesome. Northampton has been described as "Greenwich Village in farm country," to which I would add "with tons of lesbians." Hope that isn't a dealbreaker for you.
If NoHo is too expensive, look up a few miles up the 91 at Greenfield. I spent some time there with an old friend last year, and it seems like another Northampton waiting to happen.
Having spent my first 18 years in New Jersey, I can tell you that it's a lateral move from Los Angeles at best. The traffic is now just as bad, the houses are just as expensive, and you still have to shovel your driveway.
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Houston meets all of your criteria. Their is an air quality issue, but mostly in the industrial areas, not so much in town. It's known as a conservative city, but again, not the case at all in town. But you don't want to live in the suburbs anyway. Shit ton of job opportunities for teachers, lawyers and anyone with a desire to work. Culture out the wazoo. The Houston Ballet is highly aclaimed (http://www.houstonballet.org/Inside_Houston_Ballet/History/). I've read a few people mention Austin. Austin is the same as Houston, only less.
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Northampton has been described as "Greenwich Village in farm country,
As a native New Yorker I would call that a slight exaggeration... But if you want culture plus low cost of living a college town probably beats a big city. I have no idea what the job market for lawyers is but hey, people sue people everywhere, don't they?
I didn't live in Northampton but further out in the country and then in Amherst, which were bad choices. I probably would have been better off in Northampton. But as far as food, even Amherst was looking up when I left (close to 15 years ago now). Even when I lived there, there was a Chinese place - well, I have still never found anything like the chicken in spicy tea sauce at Panda Garden East anywhere else.
I ate there a lot. I went back about eight years later to visit my dissertation advisor and was picking up takeout and the guy at the restaurant recognized me. Yeah, probably a person in grad school should not eat out enough to be recognized in a restaurant eight years after leaving.
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Do not move to Cincy. It is conservative like crazy. If you're seriously considering it, also look at Louisville or Columbus. They're smaller cities but they aren't as Red State with their local politics and attitudes.
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Do not move to Cincy. It is conservative like crazy. If you're seriously considering it, also look at Louisville or Columbus. They're smaller cities but they aren't as Red State with their local politics and attitudes.
See, I didn't like Cincy because black people assaulted me downtown and white people called private security on me anywhere on the north side 'burbs.
So don't go to Cincy 'cause you will either have to fight your way outta a gas station Krispy Kreme display section or dodge rent-a-cop pepper spray.
ALSO: Both sides looked at me like a race traitor when I was spotted in public hanging about with a female co-worker who was direct from a micronesian island.
HELLA POLARIZED
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See, I didn't like Cincy because black people assaulted me downtown and white people called private security on me anywhere on the north side 'burbs.
So don't go to Cincy 'cause you will either have to fight your way outta a gas station Krispy Kreme display section or dodge rent-a-cop pepper spray.
ALSO: Both sides looked at me like a race traitor when I was spotted in public hanging about with a female co-worker who was direct from a micronesian island.
HELLA POLARIZED
What the hell? What brand of human are you, Ash? I'm Sicilian and Irish, but I get mistaken for a Latina all the time.
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I thought ST meant that the African-American community judged him racially and the Caucasain-American community judged him by economic class, each rejecting him on a different parameter.
Which... sounds a lot like how Cincinatti has been described to me by people who lived there or near there... not quite the Old South, not quite the Rust-Belt North and pretty sociologically messed up because some people want it to be one and some people who want it to be the other.
I have never been there, I caveat, but I've known a lot of people who've lived there and that's pretty much to a man how it has been described.
ALSO: I am northern Italian and miscellaneous Slavic but am often assumed to be Of The Tribe.
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Oh! Move to Winnipeg! I saw your list, and everything fits.
1. A city of at least 250k people.
Population is 619,544
2. Clean air/water, lots of greenspace. Lakes and/or ocean presence is a plus.
Loads of lakes within easy drive, tons of green space, central neighbourhoods have loads of mature trees.
3. Low crime
Sorry, crime rate's not that great... but the crime I've experienced locally has all been the vandalism/petty crime sort of stuff.
4. LOTS of cultural opportunities. I have to live in a city with a ballet company and a real dance scene and theatre scene, and art galleries/museums. This is not negotiable.
We have the Royal Winnipeg Ballet (http://www.rwb.org/) former home of Evelyn Hart, as well at the Winnipeg Contemporary Dancers (http://www.winnipegscontemporarydancers.ca/), Two major (http://www.mtc.ca) theatres (http://www.pte.mb.ca/), the largest children's theatre in Canada (http://www.mtyp.ca), a local theatre (http://www.theatreprojectsmanitoba.ca/), dozens of amateur companies, the 2nd largest Fringe Theatre Festival (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winnipeg_Fringe_Festival) in North America.
5. Lots of excellent restaurants. I have to live in a "foodie" city. Also not negotiable.
We've got major, major cultural diversity (http://www.folklorama.ca/), and a restaurant for every culture to prove it. I am walking distance from extremely high quality yet affordable Japanese, Chinese, Italian, Middle Eastern and Greek Restaurants. More importantly, we have ethnic food marts of almost every variety, making it possible to cook any type of food you want.
6. Progressive/liberal vibe. I don't need to live in hippie-town, but Mr. Muse and I are both lefties so it would be nice to be in a place that is at least tolerant of "blue" folks.
The New Democrat Party has run the province since 1999 - the NDP are sort of like a mix between the American Democrats and the Green Party - a little more left than your Democrats, but not as extreme as the Greens.
7. High value on education. A university town or at least a place with really good schools and/or a high percentage of people with college degrees and beyond.
We have four universities and one major college. If you're asking about the situation from a teacher's perspective, there are tons of teaching jobs - most schools are in an intersting transition period with a wave of teachers about to retire, and a new wave of teachers in their late 20's/early 30's moving in. It's the nature of almost every school I deal with. There are so many teaching jobs locally that you would instantly be hired and have a work Visa.
8. Strong economy/positive job market.
See note above, also just search Winnipeg jobs - you'll find a huge list. Unemployment is at an all-time low, there's lots and lots of work to be had.
9. Good housing market/growth (we want to eventually buy a condo in an urban area)
With the income level you're at now, you could actually buy a house in my neigbourhood. We did, and our income is basically the same.
10. Jobs for a dedicated, progressive teacher; and an attorney who specializes in contracts, business law, and copyright.
Basically as a young teacher, Winnipeg is a prime employer. Right now there is still a glut of older teachers, some of whom are crusty and stuck in their ways, but this group is being crowded out by new teachers with very progressive teaching theory. My oldest friend and the dozens of teachers like her who are currently taking over Manitoba schools believe passionately in arts integration into the classroom, and work very hard to create innovative and creative classroom culture. I never fail to be impressed by the teachers I meet. Of course, it's a school-by-school thing (some schools struggle with major problems, others thrive), but the general thrust is toward very positive learning/teaching opportunities. As for law, all I can do is point you to the Manitoba Bar Association (http://www.cba.org/Manitoba/home/Main/default.aspx). I don't know anything about the legal field here.
11. Smoking bans are a plus, but not required.
Indoor smoking is banned through out the entire Provence, except on reserves.
12. Vibrant "fitness" culture: lots of gyms, yoga studios, bike and jogging trails, etc.
There's lots of private gyms and many fancy new YMCA's through out the city, there's loads of yoga studios, bike and jogging trails. In winter the river is turned into a huge skating path (2nd longest in the country) every year. Beside the skating path is a foot/skiing path, and in summer we have the river walk - a series of paths that follow the river for miles and miles. The only thing I would caution is that roads are most definitely not bike friendly. This is one of the most contentious political issues in the city. Critical Mass (http://members.shaw.ca/nomalathionplease/critical.htm) is a leaderless organization that coordinates mass group cycle rides to create awareness and protest car culture. This doesn't sound like much, but the rides are normally organized on Friday afternoons during rush hour. This is incredibly subversive, and the issue is highly contentious because many motorists don't want cyclists on the road. Critical Mass rides get top headline coverage through out the summer, and people gather to both boo and cheer on the riders - fights break out, and last year there were arrests and fines during these peaceful protests.
13: High number of average days of sunlight per year. This is *critical* because I have a mood disorder.
From wikipedia: "Winnipeg is one of Canada's sunniest cities, and the weather in all seasons is characterized by an abundance of sunshine. The city receives an average of 2,372 hours of sunshine per year."
This raises the most important issue: climate. We get the heavy duty winter, and the heavy duty summer and everything in-between.
Average maximum and minimum temperatures for each month are as follows (shown as average maximum, average minimum — source Environment Canada):
January -12.7 °C (9.1 °F), -22.8 °C (-9.0 °F)
February -8.5 °C (16.7 °F), -18.7 °C (-1.7 °F)
March -1.1 °C (30.0 °F), -11.0 °C (12.2°F)
April 10.3 °C (50.5 °F), -2.4 °C (27.7 °F)
May 19.2 °C (66.6 °F), 4.8 °C (40.6 °F)
June 23.3 °C (73.9 °F), 10.7 °C (51.3 °F)
July 25.8 °C (78.4 °F), 13.3 °C (55.9°F)
August 25.0 °C (77.0 °F), 11.9 °C (53.4 °F)
September 18.6 °C (65.5 °F), 6.0 °C (42.8 °F)
October 10.8 °C (51.4 °F), -0.3 °C (31.5 °F)
November -0.9 °C (30.4 °F), -9.6 °C (14.7 °F)
December -9.7°C (14.5 °F), -19.1 °C (-2.4 °F)
This is the big up and down side of life in Winnipeg. Personally I love the variation, though I'd like it if winter was a little milder.
Some background: Our current household income is about $30k and on that we are able to afford a just-under-1000 sq-foot 2BR/2 Bath apartment in a nice area, the occasional night out, relatively upscale meals at home once or twice a week. We generally don't spend money on things like new clothes very often. I'd like to have a little more in my pocket at the end of the pay period but we're certainly not uncomfortable. We have two cars (newest one is a 2004, the older one is paid for), and about $100k in student loan debt between us. So we'd like to go somewhere where the cost of living will be comparable.
You basically just described my own household, except that housing costs are so low here that we own a two bedroom two bath home in a lower-middle class neighbourhood. You could rent a classy 2 BDR apartment somewhere hip for around $700 month. Comperably, our mortgage is less than $700 a month, so if you're willing to live in a slightly lowerclass neighbourhood you can own a house, which is pretty kick ass if I do say so myself. The primary reason we have such a huge arts and culture community here is because people can actually afford to be artists and live here. The theatre school director at our theatre is married to a dance/musical theatre instructor from the ballet, and they also own a house near by (and they can afford to raise their two children too!). It's da' shit.
I can't tell you how happy I am to live here, nevermind my SO and I being in our mid 20's and owning a house. You can come here and we'll hang out and not have babies. It'll be swell.
Also, the work Visa stuff is very easy to deal with - I hired a friend of mine who was a US citizen at the time, and got her a work permit in under a month.
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Also, the work Visa stuff is very easy to deal with - I hired a friend of mine who was a US citizen at the time, and got her a work permit in under a month.
Are you sure this is normally the case? When I worked temporarily in Canada (years ago, admittedly) I understood that it was almost impossible to hire an American for a permanent job. You had to prove that no Canadian living or possibly dead was qualified and willing to take the job. Sure, you can sometimes spin the job description to accomplish that ("frog and anteater keeper wanted, Phd in Linguistics required") but I wouldn't call that easy.
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No - it was absolutely no problem at all. I'm not talking about sallying over the boarder to work without the intention to permanently immigrate though - the person I'd hired had already moved to Canada a few months before and begun the process of applying for citizenship - this definitely made getting the work visa easy for her. Indeed, on the form I filled out, they did ask if there was no Canadian qualified to fill the spot. I indicated "no" and there was no follow up - no one called me to ask to see the resumes of the other applicants or to ask about their interviews. The truth is that so long as the employer believes there is no one more qualified than you to fill the spot, and is willing to fill out the tedious but simple paperwork, you're good to go. Then again, I'm wasn't hiring a certified teacher - the teacher's union could have all sorts of weird rules I don't know about. All the teachers I'm close to have become teachers within the past 4 years, and everyone was hired strait out of university with no teaching experience, so I just sort of figure MoF would easily have one up on all of them in the qualification/experience department. I know the government doesn't care. The number one cause of population growth in Canada is immigration. (http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/070313/national/census_main_pop) When I was hiring my American friend (she was actually just a stranger to me back then - I wasn't doing someone a favor - she just walked in and did a great interview) I did my research on this to make sure, as there were other applicants capable of doing the job I was hiring for, just not ones who were as qualified, and I made this very clear because the job I was hiring for was one that required long term stability. Basically what I have been told is that Immigration will basically wave you through if you are Anglo-Saxon, and grill the hell out of you if you're not. It'd probably be more difficult for Muse's SO - I assume the intricacies of law and the various differences between American and Canadian law might make the move impossible, but that's just a broad guess.
Wombat, in regard to your own employment prospects in Canada, you might qualify as a Skilled Worker (especially because of your specialized training) - I'm not to sure how long you've been at it, but why not take the on-line test (http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/skilled/assess/index.html) to see if you qualify? You MoF could too - I think she said she's fluent in French, which helps.
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I thought ST meant that the African-American community judged him racially and the Caucasain-American community judged him by economic class, each rejecting him on a different parameter.
Precisely the intent. Except I still use white and black as a descriptive.
What the hell? What brand of human are you, Ash? I'm Sicilian and Irish, but I get mistaken for a Latina all the time.
I have been judged to be the stereotypical perfection of the tow-headed hayseed farmboy redneck with a stong back and a weak mind. Tall, some grey that the blond hides now that I'm older, built like a life of pitching hay, wrassling livestock and cowfuck*ng. For years my given nick was 'Cornfed'. My compatriot was short, dusky and apparently beautiful in a way that made most everyone, regardless of race, openly stare at our contrast as we wandered around the local indoor mall. They weren't the 'whazzat' kind of stare either. The vibe in public was openly tense and drawn around racial and economic lines everywhere for the whole 2 months I stayed. Bad friggin juju.
I was picking up a couple dozen Krispies solo for the crew I was training from a gas n' gulp and got 2 dudes coming down one side of the aisle and one down the other yellin about me leaving some good doughnuts, it was a ruse to get in close 'cause the first dude in range grabbed onto one arm and my jacket flap. Good thing I was on Condition Red. Short version is I broke their asses in the back of the gas n' gulp. Only one dude had a weapon and I got him before he dragged it out of his jacket, no guns or I'da been extra special screwed. Sailed on out of there and noticed the clerk was just sitting there, hadn't picked up a phone or nothing. Guess he wanted to wait to see who won.
So yeah, I don't like Cincy much.
Oh! Move to Winnipeg! I saw your list, and everything fits.
I was thinking Canada too for some reason. I think the application of law could be a problem though.
As far as entry, having an employer supply the 'this person has a job waiting for them' document makes entry very easy, as Smells says. I'm still digging at engineering firms in Calgary (Canada's Arsehole, reportedly) my ownself.
If Calgary is awesome to an American and sucks to a Canadian how awesome must the rest of Canada be?
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Calgary is... yeah I don't ever want to live there. People wear cowboy hats there, like, for real... when they walk down the street and stuff. It's disconcerting.
Also, I just took the skilled worker test as if I were me, but American, and I passed! That's one hella' an annoying typical government form. Also, when my friend did get her work Visa, they required her to go to the boarder, and every time she or I called to make sure she had everything she needed, every agent we spoke to added something to the list - some form we needed to fill out, some piece of ID no one else had mentioned. I was pretty worried that she'd get there then be turned away, but she brought even pieces of ID she wasn't told she needed, which turned out to be good since they wanted her marriage license and no one mentioned that one at all.
If you ever do make it here, Sub_Ashical, it is so very sweet.
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If you ever do make it here, Sub_Ashical, it is so very sweet.
That is one damn funny mash-up. Chances are looking very much good since Spouse been back working for an international entity of evil (Haliburton's competition) and it would be of no consequence for her to transfer offices. we're just unwilling to go unless I am working as well.
I am not naming who Spouse works for as, like Nabu, I do not want all y'all to throw cancer at me.
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Slumber, Jay?
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Apparently it is a good thing I don't want to move to Canada. When I tried to take that test I discovered that zookeeper is not considered a skilled occupation. Yeah, I'll buy it, it accounts for why I was treated like shit at three quarters of my jobs in the field.
This (http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/skilled/qual-2-1.html) is the list of skilled occupations, and this (http://www23.hrdc-drhc.gc.ca/2001/e/groups/6483.shtml) is my occupational classification, which is not on the list.
Apparently not even a 'master dog trainer' is a skilled occupation. Vet techs and other animal health workers are, and farm workers including hoss trainers. But if you work with pets or exotics in any way other than veterinary you are out of luck.
Well, the heck with you, Canada. You can keep your french fries with curds and gravy.
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Cool. I scored a 72.
(My only connections to Canada are a 2 week vacation and a love of lacrosse, and I'm totally French illiterate).
Still, doesn't look like you'd toss me oot.
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Well, the heck with you, Canada. You can keep your french fries with curds and gravy.
Plus I hear that Winnipeg is teh suk (http://www.theweakerthans.org/lyrics/reconstructionsite/11onegreatcity.html) anyway
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79
Damn, Canadialand will take all sorts, I suppose...
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71. Barely made it.
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79
Damn, Canadialand will take all sorts, I suppose...
78. Heck, you beat me by one point. Do you speak French or sumpin?
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Heh. Don't be hatin' on Canucktopia.
I got an 82. I think I might qualify for more on the education side because I think I underestimated my education; I wasn't sure what qualified as "full-time or full-time equivalent studies." Mr. Muse may also qualify as a business immigrant with his ISP-starting experience.
It sounds intriguing. We have a friend in Saskatchewan who keeps trying to entice us to move north. I'm hesitant about the winters, not because of the cold and snow (can't be much different from WI), but because of the daylight hours. It's honestly *dangerous* for me to not have enough sunlight. I don't become suicidal or anything, but I do become irrational and listless and my mood swings can get pretty out of hand, and I scare myself. So climate is kind of a big factor, although I seem to manage okay here in 'Sconnie.
I'll have to give Winnipeg a look, for sure.
As to places in the US, I'm kind of intrigued by Santa Fe, still looking at NoCal with some hope (I know the cost of living is insane... I almost took a job there when I was still in the translation field, and when I did the COLA comparison I turned it down right quick. Even though the offer was twice what I was making at my job in Madison, it would have gotten me less apartment than I was living in at the time--basically it would have put me right back into the crackhouse, or nearly so). Mr. Muse has some tentative law connections out there; not sure if they'll fly or not. Atlanta sounded cool until I looked more closely, and read nothing but negative things. Plus the crime rate is nuts. Still in the process of forming the list, so keep the opinions coming, please! You have no idea how much I appreciate it.
Oh, and thanks for the heads-up on Cincy. To me it always seemed like this hip blue-collar-turned-quirky kind of place, which I kind of dig, but after these reports I'm tossing it out the window.
Mostly I've been using this site (http://www.bestplaces.net) to kind of guide my decisions, although it can be hard not knowing which cities to search on. So this is why this thread is so rad. I took the little quiz on that site to find my "best place" and I got such a wide variety of options that the results were almost useless. Everything from NY NY to Gary, IN. (*shudders*)
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I am not naming who Spouse works for as, like Nabu, I do not want all y'all to throw cancer at me.
Direct all complaints to the Monsanto Corporation!
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I seem to remember getting a pretty high score on my Who-Wants-To-Be-A-Canadian test back when I was contemplating emigrating there. All I would need is a job offer from a Canadian company and I'd be set. However, these days I would be content to move back to Colorado to get more quality chill time with Kellichou and the rest of our family.
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Direct all complaints to the Monsanto Corporation!
heh, you get a tiny can for referring to Ash/ST as Sub-Ashical.
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Direct all complaints to the Monsanto Corporation!
No No No...that is more inline with the evil multinational entity that I work for. At least Spouse works for a good old fashioned American brand evil.
And yeah, AW, I read and write French much better now than a couple years ago, because I get documents I need faster from Airbus-Toulouse if I dont wait for the english language version. Still dont speak it for nothing though from what I hear that handicap hasnt held back any Quebecois I ever met.
ON TOPIC: Have you thought about Minneapolis-St. Paul? All reports from my contacts have been good. And hey, then you could stalk Lileks instead! (Bring me the head of Jasper Dog!)
Good lord, maybe you people should throw cancer at me!
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ON TOPIC: Have you thought about Minneapolis-St. Paul? All reports from my contacts have been good. And hey, then you could stalk Lileks instead! (Bring me the head of Jasper Dog!)
That also sounds like a plan!
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Sorry I'm late to the party... the line at Bojangle's was INSANE.
Muse, I'll echo theinevitable's positive spin on Charlotte. The general consensus that I've been able to determine is that Charlotte is Atlanta, without all the crap. It's a growing city. My wife is a teacher, and everyone I talk to says that it will take her 30 minutes to find a job on account of the explosive growth once she follows me here. Couldn't tell you about your husband's prospects, but CLT is the second largest "city of finance" in the country (trailing only NYC) and there's tons of business in the area. Weather is good - decent amounts of all four seasons, and it's towards the western end of the Eastern Time Zone, so the daylight lasts juuuuuust a bit longer (I see from the map that you're towards the Eastern edge of Central, so the difference would be even more noticeable). Culture-wise, it ain't NYC or Chicago, but it's improving from what I hear. As an airline guy, I can tell you that Charlotte has more airline seats per capita than any other city in the country, in case travel is your thing.
The VA-NC-SC area as a whole has my approval, though. Someone has mentioned Raleigh - I have a friend there who just convinced his fiancee (who lived in Seattle and worked for Starbucks) to move there, and she really likes it. The Hampton Roads area of VA is a lot like Richmond, but a little bigger overall (population figures are misleading because each of the seven cities that makes the region up report separately). There's a LOT more military activity in Hampton Roads than Richmond, for better and for worse. Both states historically skew red, though Virginia has a Democratic governor and just recently elected a Democratic senator over an incumbent (although the "macaca incident (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Allen_%28U.S._politician%29#Macaca_controversy)" had a lot to do with that).
Good luck on your search!
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Gary, IN. (*shudders*)
Because I needed that song in my head all day...
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I didn't live in Northampton but further out in the country and then in Amherst, which were bad choices. I probably would have been better off in Northampton. But as far as food, even Amherst was looking up when I left (close to 15 years ago now). Even when I lived there, there was a Chinese place - well, I have still never found anything like the chicken in spicy tea sauce at Panda Garden East anywhere else.
I ate there a lot. I went back about eight years later to visit my dissertation advisor and was picking up takeout and the guy at the restaurant recognized me. Yeah, probably a person in grad school should not eat out enough to be recognized in a restaurant eight years after leaving.
I used to live in the red house across the street from Panda Garden East on Kellogg Ave., though that was...shit, nineteen years ago. I was more partial to the House Special Chicken, and the occasional scorpion bowl when I needed to get drunk quickly.
The world? It is that small.
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I used to live in the red house across the street from Panda Garden East on Kellogg Ave., though that was...shit, nineteen years ago. I was more partial to the House Special Chicken, and the occasional scorpion bowl when I needed to get drunk quickly.
The world? It is that small.
OMG. We totally could have run into each other. I totally could have been eating at the next table.
What were those dumplings with the sesame sauce? I miss those too.
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Don't think I ordered those. Pity. What years were you in Amherst?
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dang, my mom and dad were there only 9 or so years prior!
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Don't think I ordered those. Pity. What years were you in Amherst?
I try to forget but... I finished in the fall of 1991, so for the five years before that... fall 1986-spring 1991, right? I think that overlaps with nineteen years ago although of course I was in a program with no math requirement....
Oh man, you should have had those dumplings. Dumplings, chicken in spicy tea sauce, and then Black Sheep Cake for dessert at the Black Sheep Deli. Almost worth wasting five years in grad school for those memories.
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damn, them's prime Dinosaur Jr-meetin' years.
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damn, them's prime Dinosaur Jr-meetin' years.
Mascis showed up at our house on Gray St. the night the Reverb Motherfuckers played in our basement. Or so I'm told, I had no idea who he was and was tripping on mushrooms to boot.
Charlie Nakajima we saw all the time, and didn't particularly care.
Rather than gum up the rest of this thread of with Misty Watercolor Memories of Amherst Starring Wombat and Limmo, I'll just PM her later.
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I saw a band called "Trojan Hearse" play in a basement once.
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I saw a band called "Trojan Hearse" play in a basement once.
I played Ping-Pong in a basement once.
OK, more than once.
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I diddled the neighbor in her basement more than once.
Well, not really, but I used to think about it a lot.
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As a kid, my neighbors were an aging butch lesbian couple and an eighty-year-old alcoholic.
Now that I am in Los Angeles, I of course know exactly zero of my neighbors.
So I've pretty much never fantasy-ed about a neighbor and definitely never in her basement.
As previously stated, I'm more of a front bushes guy.
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hm. I have never known my neighbors in the period of time that I have been attracted to girls in any real way.
PS unless you count dorm-neighbors. In which case... it is very different.
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I diddled the neighbor in her basement more than once.
Well, not really, but I used to think about it a lot.
I have been there, brother.
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As a kid, my neighbors were an aging butch lesbian couple and an eighty-year-old alcoholic.
Now that I am in Los Angeles, I of course know exactly zero of my neighbors.
So I've pretty much never fantasy-ed about a neighbor and definitely never in her basement.
As previously stated, I'm more of a front bushes guy.
There are no basements here, so no point in starting that fantasy now.
Lots of front bushes, though. Carry on.
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I saw a band called "Trojan Hearse" play in a basement once.
I saw a band called Gas Huffer play in an attic once.
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I diddled the neighbor in her basement more than once.
I diddled the neighbor, but we don't have basements in Houston.
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goin' back to Houston
do the hot dog dance
goin' back to Houston
get me some #####
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As a kid, my neighbors were an aging butch lesbian couple and an eighty-year-old alcoholic.
We had lesbians living with us for about a year when I was maybe 12-13 years old. Old friends of my parents. I did not know they were lesbians until a few years later, after they had moved into their own apartment. I got to third base with one of the Lesbian's daughter. I was 14-15 years old at the time.
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My best friend and I both fell in love with the daughter of a lesbian. He got her. A year previous I had stopped being gay to fall madly in love with a girl, who broke up with me because she wanted to be a lesbian again.
I have bad luck with lesbians.
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A year previous I had stopped being gay to fall in madly love with a girl, who broke up with me because she wanted to be a lesbian again.
I tried to graph out how the above scenario would work, like, such as with circles around names and lines connecting them and such and... every time, I ended up with the lesbian in Biff Tannen's alternate 1985.
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There may have been a flux capacitator involved.
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Are we talking about some sort of Law of Gay Energy Conservation?
Such as you and your ladyfriend had one unit of gay between you and, ultimately, it could neither be created or destroyed but merely transfered? Were you toying with the Laws of Sex Physics?
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My parents used to rent out the main and basement floors of the massive house they lived in (they had the top two floors). They rented the main floor (one bedroom) to two ladies. My mom thought they were roommates and that the other lady slept on the couch or something. She thought this for quite a while. Then I explained the real situation to her. She asked me not to tell my dad.
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My parents used to rent out the main and basement floors of the massive house they lived in (they had the top two floors). They rented the main floor (one bedroom) to two ladies. My mom thought they were roommates and that the other lady slept on the couch or something. She thought this for quite a while. Then I explained the real situation to her. She asked me not to tell my dad.
Antics and hilarity! Are you sure you didn't grow up in a sitcom?
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Actually I didn't live in that house. It was where they moved when I moved away from home. My mother was obsessed with the idea of me moving in to the basement apartment of the house, which would have crushed my soul.
Here's a picture of my parents. (http://www.imdb.com/gallery/mptv/1098/Mptv/1098/10060-8MPTV.jpg.html?hint=nm0511964)
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Ha ha ha - whooooooo! Good times right there! I would like to send you small soda now!
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Normal Fell appeared in a dream of mine once - using a 3-section staff.
(http://www.fotolode.com/images/jaydub/3section_320x240.jpg)
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I like what Norman Fell has done with his look - I think that's going to work well for him.
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I am late to the party on this one. My first thought on reading Muse's list was Austin, TX, which someone mentioned way back there. Albuquerque might be a good fit, too.
Here is a fun diversion: This site puts you through a little quiz on what you'd like out of your town, then it suggests places you might enjoy living.
http://www.findyourspot.com/
The first time I took it, my number # recommendation was Las Vegas. Everyone thought I had tricked the system somehow, because I fuckin' love Las Vegas (though I'm not altogether sure I'd actually want to live there). But there were no questions regarding gambling or eating gluttenous buffet meals, so it just kind of worked out that way.
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Fuck that joint. It kept trying to send me to ALASKA!
Seriously, I was getting the feeling it was trying to tell me I was not fit for the rest of humanity.
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hmm. I got... basically a bunch of weird results. Except that Baltimore was #1.
I was disappointed that neither St Louis nor Charlotte was on my list.
Probably because when it asked about all those sports, I put "strongly disagree" rather than "neutral." I mean... realistically, having sports around won't make me get really upset.
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I got a bunch of basically alright University-type semi-major cities, though Chicago was strangely absent. I think I was also too prone to clicking "strongly disagree" on things I did not care about.
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Fuck that joint. It kept trying to send me to ALASKA!
Seriously, I was getting the feeling it was trying to tell me I was not fit for the rest of humanity.
HILARIOUS!
I was sent to Maine, alaska, and new hampshire. This website understood my desire for cold isolated places.
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ok, if I don't hit "strongly disagree" on things I don't care about, I still get Baltimore.
Seattle is near the top. as are knashville and knoxville, lexington, little rock...
OK, Charlotte is in the Top 10, and St Louis is in the top 24 or whatever. So, I'm happy now.
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I answered all those quiz questions and then chickened out about giving them all my personal information. I guess I'll never know.
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How can a fake person on the internet worry about real info?
1-800-philosophyblojob
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Washington state, Florida and the Redneck Riviera, and Long Island. Interesting.
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I answered all those quiz questions and then chickened out about giving them all my personal information. I guess I'll never know.
Fake name! Fake phone number! It's easy.
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#1) Portland, OR - that's going to make things simple.
#2) Honolulu, HI - people actually live there?
#3) Baton Rouge, LA - that commute would suck.
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Fake name! Fake phone number! It's easy.
Oh, aren't you clever.
Well, they seem to be confused. I am pretty sure that Little Rock should not be as high as 5th place. And Norfolk VA in first place? Didn't I say I wanted to live in a big city? Portland is 2 and Baltimore is 3, that's probably more like it.
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Oh, aren't you clever.
Well, they seem to be confused. I am pretty sure that Little Rock should not be as high as 5th place. And Norfolk VA in first place? Didn't I say I wanted to live in a big city? Portland is 2 and Baltimore is 3, that's probably more like it.
Coooooooome to me, Wombles . . .
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Nabu has inadvertently changed my life trajectory such that I am looking to live and work in alaska after college.
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I was way too lazy to fill out the personal information form even with something fake.
As I am ridiculously ignorant regarding Places In The USA it probably was no great loss.
I guess if I ever decide to emigrate overseas I'll just have to entrust the decision to you lot.
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Nabu has inadvertently changed my life trajectory such that I am looking to live and work in alaska after college.
I regret that I am unable to endorse this plan of action at this time. I hope it's not just my presence that is causing this.
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I dunno - my understanding about Alaska is that its one of the last refuges for those who chafe under Big Government (as long as that shared oil revenue check keeps coming).
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I just want to be closer to you Nabu.
really I just like the idea of being in a cold isolated place and getting paid a premium for living in a place that other people dislike. Also this idea of living in a giant indoor compound fascinates me and I have no gripe with big oil.
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I am all for people wanting to move and be closer to me. I can give that my blanket stamp of approval for any member of the board, without reservation.
I would say if a person was thinking that a permanent fund dividend check was going to make it economically feasible moving to AK, that would be like thinking that an extra $1000 would make moving from Orem UT to the middle of San Francisco fiscally sensible. However, if you chafe under The Man's iron grip, AK is for you. And the certainly make it worth my while to visit six months out of the year.
I actually feel quite guilty about it a lot of the time.
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Also, even if you enjoy a lifestyle free of the chafing hand of the Man, there is always the risk of things getting downright... Hobbesian out there, what with all sorts of other people who also enjoy that freedom and feel comfortable enforcing it via the murder act. (Hello, Joe Vogler! Also, the kid in my sixth-grade class who got shot for trespassing.)
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And Norfolk VA in first place? Didn't I say I wanted to live in a big city?
A lot a lot a lot of people live in Norfolk, Virginia Beach, and the surrounding area (I think they like to call it "Hampton Roads"). So I wonder if the site treats it like a big city on that basis, even though it doesn't feel like one, at all.
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Oh man, Joe Vogler. Nice.
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1. I think I've made the point abundantly clear that I hate The Man's grip.
2. Norfolk is a pretty big city. I lost the right to drive in Virginia while on a trip there. Virginia beach is beautiful.
3. How do i get hooked up with the indoor compound?
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A lot a lot a lot of people live in Norfolk, Virginia Beach, and the surrounding area (I think they like to call it "Hampton Roads"). So I wonder if the site treats it like a big city on that basis, even though it doesn't feel like one, at all.
Yes... yes they/we do. Norfolk was #3 for me, Charlotte, #4. So my move was apparently a bit of a downgrade. But the housing is better and cheaper here.
My #1 - El Paso, TX. Yikes.
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My brother lived in El Paso for a bit not long after he graduated from university. I would have thought it would work well for him, but he has nothing but bad things to say about it, if I can get him to do anything more than shudder.
A-CAP, are you referring to my indoor compound?