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[dejavroom]

***
PANLINGUISTICS FUN KORNER

Ugly word, eh. Imagine calling someone that. In Portuguese you can! It means basically what today's strip says about Lyle: He is a card-carrying, registered escroto.

[jaydub]

Clitorises?  Even better.  (Clitori?  Spellcheck says no.) 

1=clitoris. 2=clitorides. 3=hottt! 

[Nabubrush]

Beware the clitorides of March.

Wait, no, welcome the clitorides of March.

[Nabubrush]

I know, double-posting. Sorry, indulge me.

I got a linguistics question, too. There's going to be some background info in here that may or may not be pertinent, but I thought I'd throw it in. So, I'm in my morning call to town, trying to figure out what we did to earn yesterday's piece of our $200 million budget. There happens to be an African-American gentleman at this teleconference (at our end). He's sitting next to the guy who is filling in for the big boss. Anyway, the big boss guy (42 year old white fellow, went to school at Notre Dame) is discussing a job that has been placed on the back burner, or been delayed, or set aside, or whatever you'd call it. He, on the other hand, says that it "has gone to the back of the bus".

The first thing that goes through my mind is Rosa Parks. Obviously, any bus-related expression is fairly new. I suspect that the expression "back of the bus" originated with African-American people being asked to move back so white people could sit in the front of the bus. I don't think the expression was ever used in any other way until after Rosa Parks, and I daresay that it only rose to prominence through her. In other words, if someone uses this expression in a deliberately derogatory or offensive manner, it'll refer to Rosa Parks - and even if a person doesn't know that it's referring to her, that's where it came from.

So, I have to assume that he doesn't make that connection - i.e., when he thinks "back of the bus", he just connects it to other people who have said it, and never thinks of Rosa Parks at all. So I wonder, for all you imaginary folks out in intertubes land, if you think this is an offensive expression. I also wonder what you think about the way the language is changing in respect to expressions like this - because unless people are diligent about teaching their children about civil rights struggles, there will just naturally be fewer and fewer people who understand the origin of this particular expression. I just found it sort of interesting (and not prescriptivist vs. descriptivist, which is nice).

Back to your regularly scheduled programming, if this doesn't interest anyone.

[Ben-San]

Actually, it makes me think of school trips, when people who were misbehaving would traditionally be sent to sit in the back of the bus, several rows away from everyone else.

[CortJstr]

Actually, it makes me think of school trips, when people who were misbehaving would traditionally be sent to sit in the back of the bus, several rows away from everyone else.

You went to a weird school. The back of the bus is the cool place to sit. Kids only sat at the front due to punishment (or nerdiness).

[Nabubrush]

Actually, it makes me think of school trips, when people who were misbehaving would traditionally be sent to sit in the back of the bus, several rows away from everyone else.

Sure, Ben, but given the incident I was referring to happened in 1955, you'd have to be 60 years old to have the experience before what I was characterizing as the origin of the expression. Specifically, in the instance I was discussing, it wasn't like the guy was saying that the project was being punished. He was saying it was less valuable to the group to complete it.

My experience was much as CJ's - if you misbehaved you had to sit in the front so they could keep an eye on you.

[Nabubrush]

Miscellaneous explanatory background on the incident in question:

In Montgomery, the first four rows of bus seats were reserved for white people. Buses had "colored" sections for black people—who made up more than 75 % of the bus system's riders—generally in the rear of the bus. These sections were not fixed in size but were determined by the placement of a movable sign. Black people also could sit in the middle rows, until the white section was full. Then they had to move to seats in the rear, stand, or, if there was no room, leave the bus. Black people were not allowed to sit across the aisle from white people. The driver also could move the "colored" section sign, or remove it altogether. If white people were already sitting in the front, black people could board to pay the fare, but then had to disembark and reenter through the rear door. There were times when the bus departed before the black customers who had paid made it to the back entrance.

For years, the black community had complained that the situation was unfair, and Parks was no exception: "My resisting being mistreated on the bus did not begin with that particular arrest…I did a lot of walking in Montgomery." Parks had her first run-in on the public bus on a rainy day in 1943, when the bus driver, James Blake, demanded that she get off the bus and reenter through the back door. As she began to exit by the front door, she dropped her purse. Parks sat down for a moment in a seat for white passengers to pick up her purse. The bus driver was enraged and barely let her step off the bus before speeding off. Rosa walked more than five miles home in the rain.

[wombat]

when he thinks "back of the bus", he just connects it to other people who have said it,

But can he have ever heard anyone else use this phrase the way he uses it? I certainly never have and I find it very surprising. My first impression is that this is some kind of weird individual confusion rather than a case of language change.

[jaydub]

But can he have ever heard anyone else use this phrase the way he uses it? I certainly never have and I find it very surprising. My first impression is that this is some kind of weird individual confusion rather than a case of language change.

I think he might have gotten confused with the "back burner" allegory.

[Nabubrush]

But can he have ever heard anyone else use this phrase the way he uses it? I certainly never have and I find it very surprising. My first impression is that this is some kind of weird individual confusion rather than a case of language change.

I guess I was thinking he had just heard it a few times, and didn't really identify it with meaning anything specifically, and so just figured it meant something farther away from where he was. Something that had been removed, something that was not important.

[linnea]

I guess I was thinking he had just heard it a few times, and didn't really identify it with meaning anything specifically, and so just figured it meant something farther away from where he was. Something that had been removed, something that was not important.

Did the gentleman on the conference call say anything? Did anyone call him on it? Man, I wonder what he was thinking.

Then again...in this day and age, a lot of times people just let shit go either from incredulousness or politeness. One of my best friends is devoutly Jewish. His rebbe stopped by his office at lunch. Craig had to get something from a neighboring office, and a woman walked right in front of them and yelled at one of her officemates, "Dammit, did you kike my pencil again?"

She walked off, totally oblivious to the fact that the two dudes wearing funny little hats were Jewish and that she had said something horribly offensive. Craig and the rebbe were too shocked to say anything. The other people in the office, though...they were totally horrified. Everybody stared at her in shock.

I don't know if the "back of the bus" comment is in the same league as far as offensiveness, but...Some people are just retarded.

[smick]

She walked off, totally oblivious to the fact that the two dudes wearing funny little hats were Jewish and that she had said something horribly offensive. Craig and the rebbe were too shocked to say anything. The other people in the office, though...they were totally horrified. Everybody stared at her in shock.

My ladyfriend has a pretty obviously Jewish last name.   When she purchased her last car, the mechanic told her that the "brakes are at 35% so you can probably Jew them down on that."

I don't know if he was being unthinkingly racist, or if he was telling her to use her secret birthright powers.

[Lister]

I lived in Alabama for 25 years, and do not recall ever hearing the phrase "move to the back of the bus" used in any context.  Maybe my memory is faulty.

At work "the bus" is the latest horrible crisis that is sweeping through our department, and we discuss who is driving, flagging down, directing, or being thrown under it, but no one has ever moved to the back of it.

I can not help you with this, Nabu.

[Doc]

My first thought with back of the bus is school related too, though logically I know it doesn't hold up.