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[pmcd9]

Oh, it's that Scott Kurtz dude.  Didn't we once have a thread specifically about how much Scott Kurtz sucks?

[Victoria Waterfield]

Oh, it's that Scott Kurtz dude.  Didn't we once have a thread specifically about how much Scott Kurtz sucks?

Found it! http://touamb.com/index.php/topic,3540.0.html

[wombat]

To be fair, that podcast sucks.  I haven't even gotten to the part about Onstad and I am ready to delete it.  They have absolutely nothing to say.

Really, you should just fast forward 25 minutes in. They overestimate how fascinating their random conversation is, but when they are on topic, some of it is interesting.

[pmcd9]

It's real depressing to hear these artless hacks making the same points that we have been.

[wombat]

I thought there were some interesting points from the creator's point of view - like they talk about what exactly is so horrible about repeating yourself a little? I think it is true that lots of variations on the same theme is something that doesn't bother the readers until it gets quite excessive.

But then later on some of the discussion is based on assumptions, some of which are them trying to read his mind, and others are wrong - like they seem to be unaware that he sold self-published books for years.

Also, I think the guy who does Sheldon is not an artless hack. I dunno the others though so maybe he is running with a bad crowd.

[pmcd9]

Also, I think the guy who does Sheldon is not an artless hack. I dunno the others though so maybe he is running with a bad crowd.

The only one I know is Kurtz.  His comic is pretty lame.  I think I've seen chainsaw suit, but not sure.  Someone posted it on this board at one time I do believe.  It left no impression on me.

[theinevitable]

I like the idea of "running with a bad crowd" of webcomic creators.

I think my artist friends have fallen in with a bad crowd of really mediocre artists. They are undermining their gallery by showing bad art by their friends, and showcasing bad music by their friends. But I guess that is what it takes to network.

[littlefallsmets]

Yeah, Scott Kurtz is such a fuck*ng dick that I'd almost wanna be wrong and on Onstad's side than right and on Kurtz's.

PvP is basically everything that's wrong with web-comics, someone who could draw capably but was a fuck*ng soulless business shill first and foremost saw a fuck*ng market vacuum for "the Garfield for video game nerds", filled that motherfucker up with his septic +5 Cock of Demographic Pandering and rakes a little more cash out of his Devoted Category with every twist of his wretched sausage.

While independent comics/webcomics certainly CAN be a profession and a business with luck, talent and/or shameless calculation, they don't have to be... they can just be a hobby for some people or a side-line to make a little bread without aspirations toward a full-time career and Kurtz can't wrap his money-grubbing little fuck*ng mind around that idea.

Time and time again, the dude projects onto everyone else in the world that they're drawing and sharing their drawings with people ONLY because they're trying to find their angle to get the Charlie Brown Money Dumptruck backed up to their front-doors because that's all he sees comics as and... anyone who isn't trying for that with comics is either underachieving or doing it wrong.

Ugh. I like that the dude agrees that Onstad clearly needed to show some humility, class and appreciation of the fact that critics and fans built him the platform upon which his art was appreciated and turned into something that could be a lucrative full-time job because that's where Onstad completely COMPLETELY fucked this up.

BUT I hate that a dude who uses the word "undermonitized" in a sentence like it is the greatest sin in the world is saying it.

There's gotta be a middle ground between Onstad being a thin-skinned overly-selfexamined auteur and Kurtz being a douchebag whose only creative concern is what image would be able to sell the most lunchboxes to people who would never actually use the lunchbox, only display it on their wall.

[Nabubrush]

So, Onstad's MySpace page still offers some items for sale, but the actual Achewood page does not. It appears you can click through and buy the things on the MySpace page (although the only things offered are three posters). What's the dealio with that, do you suppose?

[littlefallsmets]

There is the possibility that myspace is so out of the zeitgeist that to log onto it is to literally communicate with three years ago.

Sort of like "The Lake House" except with self-pic spam bots makin' duckface at you.

[wombat]

I like LFM's theory, but I'm guessing it was easier to leave a few things up for sale on MySpace than on the website where it was easier to just take the whole store down.

You know, it is OK with me if he stops writing the comic, but dammit, why not sell stuff? I want a new apron. New people who find the comic will want to buy stuff. People who buy the Dark hoss books will want to buy stuff.

I get what you say, LFM, about Kurtz going too far about the "monetize" thing, but I also sort of see what he's saying. Another thing those guys discuss at length is how crazy it seems, from the point of view of another creator, that someone successful would just walk away from it.  I can understand if he is done writing it and wants to do other things creatively, but why not keep selling stuff if only to bring in cash while those new projects aren't making money yet. Lots of creative work keeps making money after it is done. If you're lucky enough to be making royalties off a book that's already published you don't turn them down because you're working on a new book. And aren't they still selling products with Peanuts on them long after the creator is DEAD, for pete's sake?

Of course maybe there are factors I don't understand about how much trouble it is too sell stuff vs how much sales slow down once there aren't new updates. But again - there aren't new updates of Peanuts, right? And couldn't he pack up my apron for shipping while he's watching TV in the evening or something? Does it really have to cut into novel-writing time? Dammit, I want a new apron.

[jaydub]

In the next Touambies, I hope this phrase gets "Most awesome display of bilious writing":

...someone who could draw capably but was a fuck*ng soulless business shill first and foremost saw a fuck*ng market vacuum for "the Garfield for video game nerds", filled that motherfucker up with his septic +5 Cock of Demographic Pandering and rakes a little more cash out of his Devoted Category with every twist of his wretched sausage.

Needless to say, that's a canning.

Why do you think the Penny Arcade guys have a soft spot for Kurtz?

[pmcd9]

Why do you think the Penny Arcade guys have a soft spot for Kurtz?

I finally found a Penny Arcade strip that made me laugh.

[wombat]

That would be funny if the art didn't make me want to claw my eyes out.

[Dangermoose]

The only thing I got a problem with is, did Onstad actually take money from people and not deliver the product they paid for?

The rest of it is just being a precious artist.  Fine.  But that there is the dick move, if it happened.  Did it?