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Author Topic: Occupy Wall Street  (Read 24295 times)

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Nabubrush

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #105 on: November 10, 2011, 08:18:16 pm »
Thanks.
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theinevitable

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #106 on: November 10, 2011, 08:29:50 pm »
I liked those. The Lakoff piece mentioned something that I've always struggled with: he basically says "workers deserve higher wages" and "people deserve jobs". How do we make companies hire more people? If they do not need more people, they won't hire them. If they can get the workers they need paying the wages they pay, they will continue paying those lower wages. How do we fix this?

I think about this a lot, because I think a lot about a fundamental shift that has occurred and makes it so that people do not want to hire me. Our economy used to need a lot of paper-pushers who were relatively educated but without specific training/skills. An anthropology major from a good school could get a job in that market. When my parents graduated from college in the late 70s with degrees in goofy liberal-arts things, they were able to get office jobs and move their way upwards.
Our economy no longer needs those people to push paper around. There is no way to force our economy backwards to where it needs those people again. They've been replaced by computers, or by more efficient systems, or better allocation of workers' time, or something. Is there anything we can (or should) do to change this?

An alternative view, which I can't confirm or deny since I wasn't alive, is that companies used to accept that they needed to train their employees. Now they do not, and can afford to do this because of the glut of job-searchers.
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littlefallsmets

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #107 on: November 10, 2011, 08:49:28 pm »
Also, let us not forget that companies are moving as much of their work to other nations where the labour laws are appalling, barbaric or just fuck*ng cheap as free where it doesn't matter that the output is substandard because it's so cheap that it doesn't matter that its bad.

When our laws should force them to conduct business either on a par with American business practices or not conduct business in America/with America/as American companies.

If we had proper regulations and/or tariffs forcing them to do that, those jobs would be here still and those moneys would be circulating within our economy, not lost to a combination of foreign investment and local wealth concentration.

And there'd be a lot more jobs for all of us.
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theinevitable

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #108 on: November 10, 2011, 09:05:15 pm »
I don't know if I believe that that would work, or would have worked.
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Nabubrush

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #109 on: November 10, 2011, 10:25:20 pm »
Well, shit, if you made it so expensive to do business with us on an import/export basis that companies would have been just as well off/bad off to keep manufacturing jobs here in the US, something would have happened, anyway. I don't know if it would have been good, but it would have been different.
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wombat

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #110 on: November 10, 2011, 10:31:54 pm »
Quote from: theinevitable on November 10, 2011, 08:29:50 pm
An alternative view, which I can't confirm or deny since I wasn't alive, is that companies used to accept that they needed to train their employees. Now they do not, and can afford to do this because of the glut of job-searchers.

I have a vague memory that this is true.
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pmcd9

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #111 on: November 10, 2011, 11:25:58 pm »
The worldwide population explosion has caused a super glut in the labor market.  This problem is only going to get worse, not better.
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wombat

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #112 on: November 11, 2011, 12:50:26 am »
But if there are more people, don't all those people need products and services, so don't you need more workers to supply them?
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Nabubrush

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #113 on: November 11, 2011, 01:02:32 am »
I think we passed the fulcrum some time ago, and now we are in a race to the bottom.
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pmcd9

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #114 on: November 11, 2011, 01:05:47 am »
Quote from: wombat on November 11, 2011, 12:50:26 am
But if there are more people, don't all those people need products and services, so don't you need more workers to supply them?

All most of those people have is crushing poverty.  They don't really know about such as products or services.  That's why a job you or I might think is worth $20 dollars an hour they will do for .50 cents.

And in the time it's taken me to type out this post another 100 people got in line to do your job for a cup of rice a day.
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Nabubrush

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #115 on: November 11, 2011, 01:07:38 am »
I thought it was "you'll work harder with a gun in your back for a bowl of rice a day".
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pmcd9

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #116 on: November 11, 2011, 05:28:45 am »
And they'll give you a little salt to put on your rice if you are one of the ones holding the gun.
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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #117 on: November 13, 2011, 11:29:23 pm »
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Arachno-capitalist

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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #118 on: November 15, 2011, 09:37:40 pm »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Wl1ObUGAoHE#!

Well hopefully they'll stop pooping in the streets for now.
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Re: Occupy Wall Street
« Reply #119 on: November 17, 2011, 09:24:35 pm »
For Inev:

Quote
@peterrothberg
Nice scene at Union Square Park. At least 2,500 spirited students. Most enthusiastic chant over People's Mic: "Fuck Internships!"
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What is this, the fuckin' Algonquin Round Table or some shit?  - Nabu

If you're going to change your life then you have to change it every day, not just the days the world isn't taking a shit on you. -Doc
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